let’s gooo
And if they don’t vote, it won’t matter.
So help them vote. Volunteer with efforts to get out the youth vote. Push for universal mail in voting where you are, or at least early voting. Help get politicians and initiatives on the ballot that they actually care about.
Shaming and complaining about the demographic you want to reach accomplishes nothing.
Obligatory-
If you are a legal resident of Wisconsin, and are not currently serving time or on paper, you can register to vote entirely online if you want, and you can request absentee ballots for all elections for the entire year (no reason needed, but necessary annual renewal, it’s my New Year’s resolution every year because it’s so easy to accomplish. entirely free of charge ofc.).
Just go to www.myvote.wi.gov to register, request absentee ballots, check your registration, or find your polling place. If you have any difficulty with your registration, you can find your local rep and contact them directly.
Please vote. Please vote for your own wellbeing. Please.
Edits to fix link redirect per convo below
This is why I love Washington. Everyone has an OPT OUT absentee ballot. Everyone gets one at your address. Every election. All the time. The same address that’s on your ID. It’s amazing.
Shame ✍️ demographics ✍️ for ✍️ helpful ✍️ advice
My state’s on it!
I hope things will change, but we still have abysmal turnout. TX started allowing early voting over 40 years ago and we still struggle to get people to the polls. Early voting is a span of 2 weeks, where in the 1st week, polls are required to be open for at least 9 hours and can be open from 6 AM to 10 PM on the weekday and shortened hours on the weekend, and in the 2nd week, polls are required to be open at least 12 hours a day and typically have the same hours as election day. Yet we still have virtually no lines through all early voting and a massive line on election day.
It doesn’t help that the news only bangs the final day of voting into peoples’ heads.
Many Republicans vote exactly on election day because they are being fed lies that early voting and mail in voting are riddled with fraud.
That explains a few people, but doesn’t explain why everyone else hasn’t been utilizing the early voting system for the 40 years prior to 2020. TX cities are pretty blue and their early voting lines are always very short.
I’ve been helping my fellow zoomers by figuring out what their townships/town wards/city districts are, then what their local/state/federal legislative/executive/judicial districts are, then who’s running for what position, then where to vote and (primaries and generals).
Information is power!
no u
But both sides are the same or my vote is worthless or it’s too hard to vote or something
That said, election day not being a federal holiday is a crime.
Which, while a good idea, still screws over the working class that don’t get federal holidays off. In fact in many industries they are mandatory work days because of the increased business.
State and federal opt-out mail ballots for all I say.
if you think both parties are the same you’re living in a fkn alternate reality. Only one part is seeking to end democracy in America and set up reeducation camps
Sarcasm
Yeah, those are all actually true.
Unless all these Gen Z kids actually fucking VOTE it won’t matter, because Boomers fucking do.
Oh, you think the choices are trash? Well fucking vote in the primaries then. Get involved at a local level, and start promoting candidates that represent you. Don’t just bitch and moan that the choice is between a codger and senile draft-dodger.
FPTP coupled with Electoral College means the only ethical vote is for the least problematic candidate.
Basic mafs. Simple as.
The reason nobody young is ever is involved with primaries is because it’s driven by corporate lobbyists. How are the youth supposed to get involved with that when they are competing against billions of dollars? The choices will always be trash until we end the lobbying. It doesn’t work with just promoting candidates that represent you. It involves massive sums of money that 99.9 percent of Americans will never touch.
Sanders came very close to winning the Democratic nomination two election cycles in a row, and his funding was largely individual donors, while Clinton and Biden were being funded by corporate interests. Sanders probably lost in 2016 because the DNC put it’s thumb on the scale; he lost in 2020 because many primary voters didn’t believe that he could win against Trump, and wanted a candidate that could peel away moderate Republicans. And that’s a national level.
At a local level, there’s a lot less money, so fucking start there, where it’s not being driven by greed.
Sanders came very close to winning the Democratic nomination two election cycles in a row,
That is some revisionist history, because he did not. He did better than any openly socialist candidate has in 100 years, but because of the rules of the DNC was not actually in contention at any point.
He came closer to winning than any other nonwinning candidate did in those two primaries.
2nd place is always “close” to winning, in a way
If Bernie was about to win the primary at any point, they would have did him like they did Bobby.
By paying attention to the media, reading platforms, thinking critically, and making it out on voting day.
When I was young, I participated in the primaries for Obama’s first election (Texas…). I was more or less put in my damn place by the older members and not allowed to have an opinion. It was Hillary this or that and racist comments otherwise. Seriously, Gen Y & Z need to participate, vote, and get involved at the primary and electoral college level or nothing is ever going to change. Don’t let those assholes decide who gets to run. I really really wonder what kind of impact those votes, in the areas that have true primaries, will have if we step up early.
We prefer millenial nomenclature thank you very much.
I literally have volunteered for local campaign offices every year since I turned 18. Don’t use cynicism to justify laziness
You don’t need to get “involved” just go get registered and fkn vote, It has a much bigger net effect that holding up signs on a street.
Lobbyists are a crucial part of the political process as far as educating legislators and their staff. Legislators cannot possibly know the workings, let alone the body of statutory and case law at play, with every activity and industry legislatures have to regulate and facilitate.
Seems like you realize the money they spread around is the problem: bundlers, megadonors, super PACs, dark money, financial and agency disclosure laws, etc., that’s where we need to start reforms.
It’s unpopular, but yeah. Also, people forget that lobbying is, at it’s core, a group of citizens with a particular interest in a specific area banding together to try and convince a politician that what they want is the best course of action. If BLM started lobbying seriously like the NAACP does (or did; I don’t know how active they are now), they’d still be working for the same cause, and likely more effectively. Yeha, you need your ground game and people in the streets engaging in protests and demonstrations, but you also need people that will directly engage with lawmakers to get shit done.
People think of the NRA as nothing but a national organization working at the federal level, but for a long time–before they really started to suck under Wayne LaPierre–they did a ton of work with lobbying at the local level, and actively worked for what their membership wanted.
I agree there’s a history of young people not voting, but every presidential election year there’s a whole group of kids who were 14 at the time of the last election but are 18 for the current one.
Every four years since I can remember, that group of kids has been increasingly engaged politically, I think recent YouGov polls on this have been like very high, like 75% intend to vote and of those like 85% intend to vote more liberal candidates.
Trump was so bad, for everyone. Everyone remembers Trump’s wanton child separation policy, his partisan Supreme Court picks, his COVID failures, and his constant lies and vitriol. Even small children can see Trump for what he is, maybe even with more clarity than most adults. Point, people who were ten years to seventeen years old at the beginning of Trump’s presidency are eligible voters now. The Republicans see this tsunami coming at them. TV news has been calling it a blue wave to scare up red voters, but it’s really a youth wave.
At the same time, older conservative voters are dying off. Republicans know they will never fairly win another popular presidential election. Their plan is to steal the White House with lawfare or outright terrorism.
Just be warned, not everyone thinks Trump was bad. A lot of people look at their economic situation prior to the pandemic, and think that it was pretty good, and so Trump must be okay. Sure, he raised taxes on the middle and lower class, but that was sold as a tax cut (…except that it was very, very temporary), and the hike went into effect under Biden.
The people who think Trump is good are lost causes. They bring nothing of value to anyone.
But if you want to win elections, that’s what you have to contend with. You have to accept that no everyone is going to see things the way you do, and you need to convince them. If you aren’t trying, then you lose.
Super this. Don’t care what anyone privately identifies as as long as it includes “voter” in the tag cloud.
I live in the rural south. TBQH, I’d rather that most of the people around me didn’t vote, since I’m pretty sure I know which way they’re going to vote, and their votes will largely be to take away my rights.
Yeah primaries are absolutely important
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Said every election since ever and nothing changes. Pipe dreams, like a general strike.
Nothing changes because the people that say they want real, significant change never show up in enough numbers to get shit done. If gen Z really gives a shit, then they need to all get out and fucking work for it. I’ve voted in every election and every primary I’ve been eligible to, since turned 22. If 100% of the gen Z kids that are eligible to vote showed up to the primaries, they could get any candidate through that they wanted. Primaries typically attract far, far fewer voters than the general election does; in some states, primary participation is as low as 3% or eligible voters.
Why is turnout always so low?
turnout for young voters (at least in US history) has always been low, people don’t get into politics usually until they hit their 30s
Yeah, why? Follow up question, do you think it’s possible to change this significantly, and if so how?
I suspect that it’s a combination of things.
I think that one thing that would help is if your employer was required to give you paid time-off to vote in primary, local, state, and national elections, say, four hours of time, but only if you actually voted. I’ll bet voting rates woudl skyrocket.
Do you not think that maybe neither party tries very hard to court the youth vote? It’s not as if 18 year olds are donating to their PACs.
Vote. Seriously. (If practical: get involved, too). The U.S. is currently in the middle of a large shift of generational power.
Many of these changes are fairly recent:
- 2020 was the first federal election where the Baby Boomers didn’t make up the largest voting generation.
- It was only in 2016 that the number Gen X and younger voting numbers grew larger than the boomer and older numbers.
- Those numbers had been possible since 2010. Despite having more eligible voters (135M vs 93M), the “GenXers and younger” only had ~36M actual voters, compared to ~57M older ones.
Looking forward, the numbers only get better for younger voters. There hasn’t been a demographic shift like this in the U.S. in a long time (ever?). The current power structures can not be maintained for much longer. It is still possible for that shift to be peaceful. Please encourage the peaceful transfer: vote. Vote in the primaries. Maybe even vote for better voting systems. This time is unique, but change takes time. Don’t let them fool you otherwise: that’s just them trying to hold on to their power.
2020 had very flexible early voting and absentee voting and many people weren’t going to work in person anyway.
Every prior year, being retired was a huge advantage for ability to go to the polling places and actually vote. It’s easy to see how retirees would be represented disproportionately given that reality.
Well, they have voted more in the last few elections. Just gotta hope they don’t get complicit and continue to show up.
Believing that nothing has changed is the most privileged form of cynicism in these threads. At ever conceivable time scale, there is plenty of progress.
There will never be a utopia. There will always be something to improve.
RIght, people just need to pick up a book and look at statistics on racism, sexism, etc and realize it’s better than it ever has been but the MAGAs are on the rise, panicking, and trying to set up a dictatorship with Trump, so go vote or lose it all.
Personally, I am too emo to vote…
Please get out and vote.
I really hope that they do.
Because I am worried about the camps.
We’re all worried about the camps.
Because people are already jumping to conclusions without reading the article. Here is the core of the survey data.
https://www.axios.com/2024/01/23/gen-z-less-religious-more-liberal-lgbtq
Identifying as Republican went from 32% in the Boomer Generation to 21% in Gen Z. Identifying as LGBTQ+ went from 4% with Boomers to 28% with Gen Z.
Because people are already jumping to conclusions without reading the article. Here is the core of the survey data. Identifying as Republican went from 32% in the Boomer Generation to 21% in Gen Z. Identifying as LGBTQ+ went from 4% with Boomers to 28% with Gen Z.
The conclusion I would have jumped to is that the percentage of Gen Z who identified as LGBTQ+ would be greater than that who identified as Republican. So it seems I don’t actually need to read it. 😜
28% LGBT is what seems dubious. Lot of spicy straights in that pool I suspect.
Nah, just more people admitting they’re bisexual.
The B part of LGBTQIA+ is doing some heavy lifting in this stat. And as usual there’s probably a lot of women who are straight but think they’re Bi because “Margot Robbie could probably get it if that was an option” kinda like a lot of guys who think admitting a guy looks good makes them gay
Yeah that’s not right. No other poll shows it being that high, but they found one they “agree” with and used that number lol
Then can we please be out and get out and vote?
I’m voting for Biden unless there’s another nominee that will be the predominant choice against Trump. I don’t like either of them but the choice is easy. Biden can’t win my state, but I’m still going to vote for him literally just because he is running against Trump. I might cow about how I ate the Dems won’t run on much else, but the contrast is big this time. It’s always been really though, the Dems should be our new right wing party and a new farther left party like the Green party ought to be the more leftist faction. Dems to me already are neolibs with a neocon leaning. Leftist Populism must be embraced by the neolibs long term. Either way something has to give. Too much wealth to go around (even globally). The greedy old ideologies of constant growth at the expense of the poorest people in the world can’t go forever. Growth economics can’t go forever either. I have hope. Just go vote because that’s what we can do easily as a minimum effort.
Biden 100% needs our energy right now. Trump will turn America into the Fourth Reich.
He might just win your state. Anything can happen.
The neoliberals won’t embrace anything unless there’s profit in it.
Preferential voting is the only chance of a progressive gaining the power they need to make desperately overdue changes to healthcare, worker rights, housing, cost of living, etc.
A neoliberal government that occasionally panders to progressives is better than a neoliberal government that gets horny at the idea of spitting in poor peoples faces, which is better than fascists.
But we need to do so much more than “not making things worse”.
The fact that you think the Green party is far left is just hilarious to me.
I take it you’re an idealist and not a pragmatist (although I don’t think the green party is pragmatic personally)
What flavour of citrus is your face?
Lemon
Citrusface is an anagram of Cactus Fire.
That is all.
I needed this.
Republicans know this, and push culture war issues to drive certain voters out of their states/area.
I’m LGBTQ…AND republican. Although that means something vastly different where I live, haha (I live in a kingdom).
The only cool kind of Republicans
In my republic (France), Republicans suck too. It looks like you’re right: cool Republicans only exist in monarchies.
Isn’t everyone in The France republican? Do you have monarchist French that want to resurrect King Louis? Or do they want to crown Macarone the new King?
P.S. I had an almond croissant earlier today and took a picture of some frozen snails.
Almost everyone is Republican, but we also have a Republican Party, which isn’t more Republican than the others, this name makes zero sense. It’s the successor of the party of De Gaulle, but I’m quite sure De Gaulle wouldn’t like what this party became.
There are a few monarchist movements, generally far-right-leaning, like the French Action. But they are very small and divided (there are two candidates for the throne, and different kinds of monarchies), so nobody takes them seriously.
PS: croissants are good; snails aren’t.
De Gaulle
He really hated the English - which is a bit rich considering we sheltered him during the war. He was proven right on the EU though. We did nothing but cause trouble while in, then left. Precisely what he predicted. :(
PS: croissants are good; snails aren’t.
A civilised French! A rare, but welcome, breed. I forgive you for Patay, Formigny, and Castillon. Joan of Arc was obviously suffering the Snail Madness and didn’t realise English rule was superior.
I don’t think De Gaulle hated the English, but he surely despised them. He despised almost everyone though, and maybe he despised the French more than anyone else, calling us “calves” or mocking our love for cheese, for example. Yeah, he was an asshole.
They should employ you at the Paris tourist board. You’re a decent French and you know facts! Paris needs that. 👍
Had me in the first half not gonna lie
Our time will come
Now if they’d just vote….
Golly I remember once on Reddit saying that people should vote and by howdy did a whole bunch of angry people vote me down double digits because, you see, apparently voting doesn’t matter and I made people feel sad.
To be fair, I’ve voted my whole adult life and don’t really feel like anything is better off because of it. I will continue to vote for the lesser evil, but I also completely understand why people are frustrated with this system. We just keep voting between a turd sandwich and a giant douche, and it gets old. So it doesn’t surprise me when people feel like voting is useless, it feels like it’s hopeless by design. We need a new system.
They do vote…they’re in areas where their vote doesn’t count.
A lot of us aren’t old enough to vote yet
Ok you get a pass 😉
I’m a bit confused by this.
Does this imply that the human race is drastically more sexually fluid than most species when allowed to be without oppression? Or that the culture gen z has grown up in helps cultivate a more fluid preference?
I grew up in the 80s, so I’m trying to understand, but it’s tough meshing statements like this with my experiences.
Please don’t misunderstand this post as disapproval. Just confusion.
Amazing what not punishing things does
Baseball?
Baseball (and sports in general) are wonderful man made examples of evolution and how selection pressure can force the expression of certain traits. About 25% of MLB players are left handed, versus about 10% in the general population.
A similar thing has occurred in the NBA where the average height is about 6’6” (or 198.6cm for those opposed to Freedom Units), which is about 8 inches taller than the average American male.
Doubtless, you can look at any top level professional sport league and find some physical trait (or set of traits) that is wholly disproportionate compared to the general population due to those traits providing some advantage(s) that is unique to that game.
That’s true… And what I was (jokingly) referencing…
But, my Dad’s mother, my Granny…
She was a natural Lefty…
And musically inclined…
Her Daddy slacked the strings on the family guitar before he left for work…
She figured out how to tune that instrument…
Those in her church, later, made fun of her for playing backwards chords, because she was a lefty. .
She learned to play the other way, too… And she taught me both…
There’s so many sides and nuances to every thought in our lives…
It was a harmless joke, but it has roots in my reality…
This shit is so often much deeper than we think…
You made a fuckin hell of a statement, but it’s without context or understanding…
I was just making an off-handed joke…
There is a fucking shitload of lefties in baseball… Because it fucks with the righties when they’re batting…
I think it’s mostly that very few of them identify as Republican.
But also, the less stigma around gender expression, the more kids will be open to explore theirs.
That’s not what the data said.
https://www.axios.com/2024/01/23/gen-z-less-religious-more-liberal-lgbtq
Identifying as Republican went from 32% in the Boomer Generation to 21% in Gen Z. Identifying as LGBTQ+ went from 4% with Boomers to 28% with Gen Z.
Both changes are major, but the LGBTQ+ change is massive.
It’s probably worth mentioning we recognize certain types of people as part of the LGBTQ+ umbrella who were not before. Asexual people, for example.
Also huge swaths of bi people and a lot of people who are now understood as gay and trans as opposed to straight people who hate their body and life but got rejected from hormones
The best explanation I’ve heard is that it’s similar to the stats for left-handed people. Way back in the day, almost no one “identified” as being left-handed. But once the stigma against left-handedness was eliminated, the numbers went up.
So in other words, yes, it’s a reflection of LGBTQ+ becoming more acceptable, particularly among Gen Z. There could be other factors, but that’s probably the main one.
28% seems huge, though. Are there any other animals like that? I’m kind of confused how it’s that high even with acceptance lol.
It’s mostly bisexuals. You know like Julius Caesar, Alexander of Macedon, and large swaths of people in cultures where same gender romance or sex is acceptable in certain circumstances so long as you also marry and have children.
Is there data to back that claim up?
Not arguing but also something I hadn’t heard before. That there has been an absolutely massive increase in # of people identifying as bi and that that is the majority of LGBTQ+
I can’t recall any off the top of my head and it’s definitely anecdotally been my experience as someone who came out about a decade ago and has been a geek about queer history for about that long. Like there are definitely more homosexuals and a lot more open trans people (but trans people are estimated at absolute highest to be 1% of the population, and more realistic high end estimates last I checked are .3%-.5%), but bi folks have been coming out of the woodwork.
Most male dogs hump your leg regardless of who you are
Male ducks will even do necrophilia with other males.
I get your point, but “most”? I’ve had 5 male dogs of my own over 40-ish years, and have known or met many, many others and I’ve never once had my leg humped.
Maybe they don’t think you’re hot enough /s
Yes. Bonobos.
Human appear to be about halfway between chimps and bonobos on the primate spectrum. The violence of chimps combined with the fluid sexual social habits of bonobos lol
https://phys.org/news/2019-09-insights-same-sex-sexual-interactions-important.amp
The article pointed out that the same sex encounters were only high for females, idk if that’s that similar to humans.
Part acceptance, part widening the net of what’s included in the category.
It’s a confluence of factors. LGBTQIA+ is sort of a gender/sexuallity/ phenotype physicality solidarity alliance and the actual boundries has grown in scope since the 80’s.
Like take for instance asexual people. Asexuallity became a part of the solidarity when people reached out over the internet and and started realizing that there were a lot of people who just don’t feel sexual attraction and that there are certain widely accepted forms of social coercion that revolve around pushing people towards sexual attraction. But asexuallity as a part of the LGBTQIA only really became a thing in the early 2000’s. Non-binary trans identities are much the same. A lot of people were feeling the way they did about themselves in isolation but they had no frame of reference to think that they were not just the odd person out.
The other half is a society wide re-examination of compulsory heterosexuallity/cis gender hegemony. There are way more people out there who no longer define themselves by who they’ve chosen to have physical sexual experience with and now a lot more people are more frank about defining themselves by the range of people they are attracted to. Like if the majority of people artificially penalize a bi-person for choosing a same sex relationship a lot of people will just take the easier path and just narrow their choices or keep their liasons with the restricted choice secret and not assume the label.
I before I came out as trans initially figured I didn’t count as trans because I both wasn’t physically transitioning and my industry is somewhat hostile to trans people so I was very closeted ao I figured the label only really belonged to the people brave enough to live out of the closet… But eventually someone found me and was like “No, it’s not aspirational. Even deep in the closet you are still trans.”
This combination of destigmatization, solidarity messaging, the inclusion of whole other groups (like intersex people, gender minorities, asexuals) broadening the scope and outreach to the closeted means that more people generally self identify as LGBTQIA or queer.
Animal kingdom wise we’re still less observably sexual fluid than other primates. Bisexuality is actually pretty ubiquitous particularly amongst male primates with it actually being the overwhelming norm in some species so chances are we are probably actually haven’t seen the curve level off from suppressive stigma.
LGBT as a category has been increased a lot over the years. Asexual or people who don’t feel they conform to super strict gender norms are all included as “queer” now. So I imagine it’s a combo of things, some people being trendy, some people being freer and not feeling the need to hide, some people who previously didn’t identify being included.
Left handedness was persecuted and after it stopped being persecuted there was a massive rise in people who were left handed. But it plateaued and has remained pretty stable since then.
I believe it’s your first option, acceptance for being yourself is the normal instead of a beating from your parents like pre 2000.
The 11% dip for the GOP makes sense. Their policies are just not in line with what young people value.
That said, the +24% gain in LGBTQ+ identification is fascinating and I would love to know how nature, nurture, taboo, and oppression play impact that. This would be a really cool time to be in university and studying human sexuality and gender.
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LGBTQ came out if the closet and GOP went in.
Putting sexuality in such a defined state is relatively new in human culture. So most often no one would have the worlds to talk about it or even know it could be classified differently.
Our closest related species gets it on so much in so many ways it is one STD away from extinction. It might be that we really are like this. Maybe the norm for humans was to have random homosexual and hetrosexual orgies everywhere. It was only because it became important to know who the daddy was that things changed? Or the sampling of the survey wasn’t great. You know groundbreaking or meaningless.
Some of it is a rejection of previous values - toxic masculinity and toxic femininity. Some of it may be standing with their peers even if it does not apply directly to them. Some of it is trendiness. Some doctors are even predatory, seeking to sell their extraordinarily expensive surgeries for tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars. Older, established trans communities in Europe even are shocked at how young we allow surgeries in the USA, before someone knows who they truly are.
Mainly we just have an extremist society here, egged on in large part by our predatory clickbait media that always has to come up with something to
saysell, so it ignores the >80% in the middle and focuses exclusively on the flashiest content it can find. And then kids hear that and wonder how they fit into it - ofc they never see the “middle ground”, b/c in the media it just isn’t there.Take a look also at how shockingly high rates of suicide and opioid and other drug use are. The younger generations are desperate to become anything else besides what boomers are telling them they must be: literal slaves to the corporate empires.:-(
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No, they’re just not being persecuted by narrow-minded superstitious assholes like in past decades.
I would identify as ANYTHING before as a republican
like a helicopter? ;-)
No. But a hive of bees, perhaps. What about you?
A grasshopper, because of the grass, and because of my thighs
ThankFuckingGod.jpg
As it should be. FUCKING VOTE! And remember, by not voting for Biden, you are voting for Trump whether or not you actually cast a vote. ALL of the Trump supporters WILL show up on the day.
Either way you’re voting for a Palestinian genocide and the continuation of neoliberal imperialism.
Edit: the future is bleak either way, Biden has explicitly shown support for the continuation of support for Israel as well as the bombing campaign in Yemen and Syria. All this is to say that there is genuinely nothing we can do to help the middle east in this election.
But sure, we can get a better minimum wage or whatever.
But only one of the genocidal imperialists will peacefully step down in 2029.
I truly don’t think that matters. If Biden wins trump is just going to claim that the election was falsified again. We’re looking at a boiling point situation with no real answer.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m probably still going to vote for Biden unfortunately. But people acting like the choice is so clear are not reading the writing on the wall.
Edit: people down voting this forgot that trump and his supporters literally have stated that if he is not in office this year, they will do more than they did on January 6th. Many of them will call for an all out civil war. The problem isn’t the end of the next term, it’s the inauguration.
If they try again to do another January 6, or if they had tried to go further last time, they would have been met with force of the US military and they would be absolutely crushed.
Also, the Civil War was organized and planned in secret, long before the NSA and FBI existed, predator drone and hellfire missiles. I don’t think another one could get far enough along to pose an existential threat.
The capital insurrection ended exactly how a 3%'r civil war would end: they’d smear a bunch of shit on the walls until one of them fucks around and finds out, and then they’ll hide their faces as they scurry away out the back door, back into their mom’s basements and motor homes.
https://www.jcs.mil/Portals/36/Documents/JCS Message to the Joint Force JAN 12 21.pdf
The same could be said for trumps proposed future attempt to remain in office. The military did not ever really side with trump.
Grow up bro, we don’t care about your pet bleeding heart topic, either vote for Biden or be prepared to be persecuted in a Trumpian dictatorship.
You don’t care about Palestinian hospitals and children being firebombed? Dope.
Edit: I’m sorry but telling me to grow up while also saying the phrase “trumpian dictatorship” has gotta be one of the funniest things I’ve ever read.
me being told to grow up by another lemmy user is literally 1984 guys
Funny equals censorship complaint.
You’re a fucking retard
Biden is awful, but I would take him over orange Hitler any day of the week. Heck, I would take DC’s Joker over Trump… that will put a smile on everyone’s faces.
Yeah I feel like people misunderstand what I’m saying as though I’m considering voting for trump. I’m not at all. I’m just trying to figure out how well voting for Biden sits on my conscience, or if id rather write in daffy duck this year.
Trump is not on the menu for me, and I feel like I’ve made that fairly clear but not once talking about voting for him.
Of course, no one here is seriously accusing you of voting for Trump; the thing I’m trying to say is that there are a lot of magadiots who will do everything in their power to get Trump back in the White House. There is also a lot of voter suppression in poorer neighborhoods with minorities who tend to vote blue in hopes they give up and go home, which gives republicans an advantage.
There is a very real chance Trump will win in the coming elections, so everyone who opposes Trump and what he stands for should absolutely vote for Biden even if he is awful, because if Trump is back in the White House, there is a real possibility this will be the last election.
I’m saying this as someone who was very cynical about politics for years and didn’t always vote during my life, and have come to regret not voting immensely.
I understand where you’re coming from, but I still don’t think it’s anyone’s right to tell me or anyone else that they are obligated to vote for any president.
Vote for everything else, vote in your local elections. That’s what changes things. But I don’t believe it’s my duty to vote for one of two pieces of shit every election just because of some screeching fucking retards on the Internet.
I’m not telling you you are obligated to do anything, I’m just asking you to reconsider because I’ve been there and deeply regretted not having voted in the past.
Yes, voting in local elections is probably going to make an immediate and tangible difference to your community, and should be encouraged for everyone to participate, but it’s still really important to vote in the presidential elections to keep Trump out of the White House. There is a real risk that if Trump wins in 2024, there won’t be a 2028 election at all…
No, there is no concern that the term limit will be removed or expanded. It hasn’t happened since the amendment was ratified, even after multiple attempts from politicians of various rank and from each party.
There are plenty of things to be concerned about, but the “trump will become the life long leader of the United States in his presidency” rhetoric is stupid and unfounded.
Nixon couldn’t do it, truman couldn’t do it, trump is not as competent or capable as either of these presidents. It will not happen. This is literally the same shit republicans used to say about Obama and it didn’t happen then.
He would have to convince 3/4s of the states in both the house of representatives and Congress to ratify, and there is no way he could do that.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-second_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution
No. You don’t get to tell me that I have to vote for Biden when he’s not doing anything to earn my vote. He’s allowing Israel to carry out a genocide. So he’s not actually less evil than Trump. You’re just upset because Trump’s shitty policies will impact you more than Biden’s shitty policies. Biden has the lower approval ratings than Trump did at this point. He has not earned a second term.
How about the Dems run a candidate who isn’t dog shit? I vote for Dems as a form of harm reduction, but they aren’t reducing harm anymore. So what’s in it for me? Dems haven’t not done anything about the supreme court, student loans, or threats to democracy and they are largely supporting the actions of Israel. If I’m right, and this is a genocide (I am), then voting for anyone who supports it would be an evil act. They’re going to have to make some changes if they want to earn the votes of people who don’t want to see a genocide carried out on our watch with our bombs.
That said, it would be a real problem if Trump won. So if that happens, I hope you’ll be willing to place the blame where it belongs: with the Democrats. They are the ones doing nothing to earn our votes. Biden isn’t even campaigning.
Okay. But Palestine still gonna be fucked. I get that you don’t care if Palestinians die. But I do. So I get to not vote for the guy currently enabling their genocide. “Trump would do it too” so you admit it’s bad? Demand better from your politicians you weakling.
If you think Palestine is still fucked either way then choosing to empowerer Trump makes even less sense. I think it’s a fact that Trump will be far worse for Palestinians than Biden, but even if we assume they will both be just as terrible on this issue, Trump is also terrible on every issue. If your choice is terrible and completely terrible, logically you should go with terrible. The other choice is even worse.
How could trump be worse?what is worse than arming the Israelies while they engage in genocide? Unless you don’t believe that’s what is happening. In which case,you have been misinformed. Genocide is genocide. Why am I the asshole here for not wanting to vote for someone who is enabling a genocide? Why isn’t Biden the asshole for enabling the genocide or not stepping down?
ah, so the single-issue voter. actually it’s not even single-issue, that’s just giving up status quo in order to effectively vote for worse than status quo. that’s called having a narrow view on the world, you know the middle east isn’t the only thing that exists in american politics right? there are still other things to improve on rather than just saying “oh israel-palestine conflict is going to shit either way therefore why even bother, might as well fuck up every other political issue, it’s useless if we can’t have this one win”.
grow up, you’re effectively casting all your friends and loved ones into the flames with your stubbornness, and casting palestinians into the flames considering trump is going to rail way harder against palestine than biden does. it’s not like not voting means no palestinians die, why do you have this delusion that you have blood on your hands if you vote but no blood on your hands if you don’t. it helps nobody and improves nothing except your own ego because you get to say “oh well i didn’t vote for genocide!” even though you practically voted for more genocide.
It’s not my only issue with Biden, but it is my biggest and the fact that it doesn’t even seem to register as a problem for you is very telling. You don’t care about anything that’s happening to anyone outside of the US huh? Your world is that small? Get a grip. We all draw our lines in the sand somewhere and when the line is crossed, that’s usually the thing we’re going to yell about. I think “I can work with you on anything other than genocide related crimes” is pretty fucking lenient, don’t you?
If you can’t see how Trump is worse than Biden I don’t know what to say. It should be self evident at this point that a second Trump presidency will be a disaster for the world. As far as Palestine goes, Biden has pissed off Netanyahu and there’s a whole diplomatic row unfolding right now because Biden said there has to be a two state solution and Netanyahu says no. I guess you’re unfamiliar with Trump somehow but based off his previous behavior he would be more likely to help Netanyahu and encourage him to do even worse things. Trump certainly wouldn’t be getting into a public spat where he’s insisting on a Palestinian state, he’s definitely not going to do anything to stop what Israel is doing, or even to discourage them.
I don’t believe this “row” with Netanyahu will amount to anything, which I am basing on Biden’s record of always backing Israel every single time. You and I agree about Trump. We’ve clearly come to different conclusions about Biden. I don’t think we are going to get any further in this conversation.
Also, the idea that Trump “certainly” wouldn’t get in a public spat when he is, in fact, Donald Trump and public spats are exactly his MO is fucking laughable.
How could trump be worse?
Trump (to black Americans) in 2016: What do you have to lose?
You’re basically just spouting Trump talking points.
Trump would obviously not only support Israel’s position he would sell them more weapons…wouldn’t care at all about the Palestinian human rights angle and he would allow Russia to walk into Ukraine and that’s just the “foreign relations” plan…domestically, he’s planning on setting up concentration camps for the homeless and undocumented.
So he would do what Biden is doing but more… Justify voting for him however you want. Biden is just as supportive of Israel as Trump would be.
Not arming the Israeli’s and letting Iran try to start a war it cannot win, which would result in a domino effect of failed middle eastern states, tens of millions of deaths, and tens of millions of war refugees.
Oh but by all means burn the fucking planet down and destroy democracy for 350,000,000 Americans because you want everyone to know how super sad you are over 25,000 avoidable deaths.
The fuck? So just let Israel kill civilians. Cool. I was wrong. You’re not a psychopath. You’re someone who would have gone along with the Nazis.
Bro I don’t care about Palestine that much right now, nothing we can do there, that’s on Israel, Iran and the middle east, you better look in your own fkn back yard because dictatorship is just around the corner while everyone is worried about the next marvel movie and causes they don’t really have any power to effect.
We’ve been selling Israel weapons while they declare exactly what they want to do. What the fuck are you talking about? Biden has gone around Congress twice to sell weapons to Israel. But sure. Nothing we can do. Get fucked.
Palestinians don’t care if Palestinians die. They huddle up around Hamas members and tunnel entrances to die as proud martyrs, human shields for their terrorist captor’s absolutely deranged anti-social and religious beliefs.
It’s very sad that 600,000 to 800,000 people in Gaza ignored the evacuation warnings or were held as voluntary and involuntary human shields by a terrorist organization. The terrorists and their patron state Iran are absolutely psyched that Kentifer got tricked into openly supporting terrorism by these otherwise easily avoidable deaths. Really, it’s very sad that Hamas has no regard for the lives of the people it falsely claims to serve.
The hard right authoritarians of the world support Hamas and call these deaths genocide; Iran, Malaysia, Brazil, Iraq, Syria, etc.
The liberal world order supports Iarael’s right to self defense; America, the EU, NATO, UK, France, Australia, Norway, Austria, Poland, Germany…even Canada.
Think about that and consider whether it not maybe you really have been tricked, why you’re siding with Iran over Canada?
You are a genocide apologist and I hope you live to feel the shame you deserve to feel.
okay, then welcome your next dictator Donald Trump and all that implies (Gilead like conditions, rescending civil and gender rights, requiring Christian worship or prison/execution, an end to all journalism and only Trumpian little red books where you pledge allegiance to him every day or get reported to the police)
And I will thank dems for running centrists while Gilead kills me for a trans queer person. Dems aren’t helping prevent Gilead as much as you think.
That said, it would be a real problem if Trump won. So if that happens, I hope you’ll be willing to place the blame where it belongs: with the Democrats. They are the ones doing nothing to earn our votes. Biden isn’t even campaigning.
Biden is governing. He’s doing the job he was elected to do. Perhaps that’s enough to earn some votes? Or are votes only earnt by rallies and advertisements?
In any case, it’s completely silly to blame the Democrats for losing if you don’t vote for them yourself. If you prefer Democrats over republicans, then you have to vote for them. Even though they aren’t perfect. If you don’t vote, then it is totally unreasonable to blame anyone else for getting an undesired outcome. Not voting implies that you have no preference.
(And yet again, this is another case where ‘ranked choice’ voting / preferential / instant-runoff would make this whole situation a lot easier. USA could really use some serious electoral reform.)
Also, what if I don’t think Biden did what I elected him to do?
I don’t currently prefer democrats over Republicans. I think they are equally harmful in different ways. What do I do? I agree that Republicans are wrong on everything, but Dems are wrong on enough things, and majorly so, that I don’t think that they can be reformed. RCV is a pipe dream for the US at large. Especially with dems in positions of power. They haven’t historically been willing to give up power once they have it.
I don’t currently prefer democrats over Republicans. I think they are equally harmful in different ways. What do I do? I agree that Republicans are wrong on everything, but Dems are wrong on enough things, and majorly so, that I don’t think that they can be reformed.
Honestly? You grow up and read some books. Start with any of Bernie’s books. As you read, try and answer why Bernie, the most popular and longest serving third party politician in history, ran for president by seeking the Democratic nomination instead of running as an independent.
The answer is that the DNC can be changed and has shifted significantly to the left in the last eight years, and will continue to do so. However if you idiotically allow Trump to win the presidency, it will likely be the last presidential election you ever get to vote. The DNC might be made illegal.
The choice is hope for the future or no hope for the future.
And Bernie failed to make any headway because the private club shut him out. How about you grow up and stop making excuses for voting for an old man who aids and abets genocide?
Vote however you want. It’s your choice. If you prefer Republicans, then vote for them. I’m just saying that if you choose not to vote for Democrats, it’s silly to then go on to blame the Democrats for Trump being in power. ‘Blame’ implies that you are unhappy with the outcome, but it is effectively an outcome that you yourself chose with your vote.
If you don’t want Trump to win, then you should choose to vote against him. If you don’t, you yourself are the one to blame. (That said, if you are happy to have that demented tyrant as your president, then go ahead and vote for him. It’s your choice.)
If Dems need my vote to win, then they need to run a candidate that doesn’t support genocide in Palestine. If they can’t or won’t do that, then they are forfeiting my vote. If they do that and lose, then they are the one’s “at fault” for losing.
Man it’s crazy how these people think they can instill some false duty onto any leftist to “do the right thing” without actually weighing each of the choices carefully. They just see a D next to someone’s name and think they must be the good guy, regardless of what they say.
Did we all forget about the kids in cages on the border? Or the lack of free healthcare/college? Did we forget about the union busting? Biden is not a good guy, he’s just barely better than Trump. He’s certainly better at hiding the heinous shit from everyone.
But yeah man, were all bad people and unamerican for wanting a better choice and hating our hand I guess?
Not unAmerica, just impractical and immature.
Explain to me how being reluctant to vote for one of two presidential candidates due to their policies and global politics is immature. Am I supposed to just say “well millions will die either way but at least sleepy Joe relieved some student debt?”
What’s impractical is running a country off of the lesser of two evils vote.
What a glorious headline!
This shows that:
If you identify as LGBTQ, you are less likely to vote Republican.
Fuck yeah.
