As it should be. FUCKING VOTE! And remember, by not voting for Biden, you are voting for Trump whether or not you actually cast a vote. ALL of the Trump supporters WILL show up on the day.
Either way you’re voting for a Palestinian genocide and the continuation of neoliberal imperialism.
Edit: the future is bleak either way, Biden has explicitly shown support for the continuation of support for Israel as well as the bombing campaign in Yemen and Syria. All this is to say that there is genuinely nothing we can do to help the middle east in this election.
But sure, we can get a better minimum wage or whatever.
I truly don’t think that matters. If Biden wins trump is just going to claim that the election was falsified again. We’re looking at a boiling point situation with no real answer.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m probably still going to vote for Biden unfortunately. But people acting like the choice is so clear are not reading the writing on the wall.
Edit: people down voting this forgot that trump and his supporters literally have stated that if he is not in office this year, they will do more than they did on January 6th. Many of them will call for an all out civil war. The problem isn’t the end of the next term, it’s the inauguration.
If they try again to do another January 6, or if they had tried to go further last time, they would have been met with force of the US military and they would be absolutely crushed.
Also, the Civil War was organized and planned in secret, long before the NSA and FBI existed, predator drone and hellfire missiles. I don’t think another one could get far enough along to pose an existential threat.
The capital insurrection ended exactly how a 3%'r civil war would end: they’d smear a bunch of shit on the walls until one of them fucks around and finds out, and then they’ll hide their faces as they scurry away out the back door, back into their mom’s basements and motor homes.
Biden is awful, but I would take him over orange Hitler any day of the week. Heck, I would take DC’s Joker over Trump… that will put a smile on everyone’s faces.
Yeah I feel like people misunderstand what I’m saying as though I’m considering voting for trump. I’m not at all. I’m just trying to figure out how well voting for Biden sits on my conscience, or if id rather write in daffy duck this year.
Trump is not on the menu for me, and I feel like I’ve made that fairly clear but not once talking about voting for him.
Of course, no one here is seriously accusing you of voting for Trump; the thing I’m trying to say is that there are a lot of magadiots who will do everything in their power to get Trump back in the White House. There is also a lot of voter suppression in poorer neighborhoods with minorities who tend to vote blue in hopes they give up and go home, which gives republicans an advantage.
There is a very real chance Trump will win in the coming elections, so everyone who opposes Trump and what he stands for should absolutely vote for Biden even if he is awful, because if Trump is back in the White House, there is a real possibility this will be the last election.
I’m saying this as someone who was very cynical about politics for years and didn’t always vote during my life, and have come to regret not voting immensely.
I understand where you’re coming from, but I still don’t think it’s anyone’s right to tell me or anyone else that they are obligated to vote for any president.
Vote for everything else, vote in your local elections. That’s what changes things. But I don’t believe it’s my duty to vote for one of two pieces of shit every election just because of some screeching fucking retards on the Internet.
I’m not telling you you are obligated to do anything, I’m just asking you to reconsider because I’ve been there and deeply regretted not having voted in the past.
Yes, voting in local elections is probably going to make an immediate and tangible difference to your community, and should be encouraged for everyone to participate, but it’s still really important to vote in the presidential elections to keep Trump out of the White House. There is a real risk that if Trump wins in 2024, there won’t be a 2028 election at all…
No, there is no concern that the term limit will be removed or expanded. It hasn’t happened since the amendment was ratified, even after multiple attempts from politicians of various rank and from each party.
There are plenty of things to be concerned about, but the “trump will become the life long leader of the United States in his presidency” rhetoric is stupid and unfounded.
Nixon couldn’t do it, truman couldn’t do it, trump is not as competent or capable as either of these presidents. It will not happen. This is literally the same shit republicans used to say about Obama and it didn’t happen then.
He would have to convince 3/4s of the states in both the house of representatives and Congress to ratify, and there is no way he could do that.
No. You don’t get to tell me that I have to vote for Biden when he’s not doing anything to earn my vote. He’s allowing Israel to carry out a genocide. So he’s not actually less evil than Trump. You’re just upset because Trump’s shitty policies will impact you more than Biden’s shitty policies. Biden has the lower approval ratings than Trump did at this point. He has not earned a second term.
How about the Dems run a candidate who isn’t dog shit? I vote for Dems as a form of harm reduction, but they aren’t reducing harm anymore. So what’s in it for me? Dems haven’t not done anything about the supreme court, student loans, or threats to democracy and they are largely supporting the actions of Israel. If I’m right, and this is a genocide (I am), then voting for anyone who supports it would be an evil act. They’re going to have to make some changes if they want to earn the votes of people who don’t want to see a genocide carried out on our watch with our bombs.
That said, it would be a real problem if Trump won. So if that happens, I hope you’ll be willing to place the blame where it belongs: with the Democrats. They are the ones doing nothing to earn our votes. Biden isn’t even campaigning.
Okay. But Palestine still gonna be fucked. I get that you don’t care if Palestinians die. But I do. So I get to not vote for the guy currently enabling their genocide. “Trump would do it too” so you admit it’s bad? Demand better from your politicians you weakling.
If you think Palestine is still fucked either way then choosing to empowerer Trump makes even less sense. I think it’s a fact that Trump will be far worse for Palestinians than Biden, but even if we assume they will both be just as terrible on this issue, Trump is also terrible on every issue. If your choice is terrible and completely terrible, logically you should go with terrible. The other choice is even worse.
How could trump be worse?what is worse than arming the Israelies while they engage in genocide? Unless you don’t believe that’s what is happening. In which case,you have been misinformed. Genocide is genocide. Why am I the asshole here for not wanting to vote for someone who is enabling a genocide? Why isn’t Biden the asshole for enabling the genocide or not stepping down?
ah, so the single-issue voter. actually it’s not even single-issue, that’s just giving up status quo in order to effectively vote for worse than status quo. that’s called having a narrow view on the world, you know the middle east isn’t the only thing that exists in american politics right? there are still other things to improve on rather than just saying “oh israel-palestine conflict is going to shit either way therefore why even bother, might as well fuck up every other political issue, it’s useless if we can’t have this one win”.
grow up, you’re effectively casting all your friends and loved ones into the flames with your stubbornness, and casting palestinians into the flames considering trump is going to rail way harder against palestine than biden does. it’s not like not voting means no palestinians die, why do you have this delusion that you have blood on your hands if you vote but no blood on your hands if you don’t. it helps nobody and improves nothing except your own ego because you get to say “oh well i didn’t vote for genocide!” even though you practically voted for more genocide.
It’s not my only issue with Biden, but it is my biggest and the fact that it doesn’t even seem to register as a problem for you is very telling. You don’t care about anything that’s happening to anyone outside of the US huh? Your world is that small? Get a grip. We all draw our lines in the sand somewhere and when the line is crossed, that’s usually the thing we’re going to yell about. I think “I can work with you on anything other than genocide related crimes” is pretty fucking lenient, don’t you?
alright then my guy, what does trump do better than biden that makes you want him to win instead? because you seem so happy to give trump an extra vote. what would trump do better outside of the US since that seems to be where your concern lies? how will not voting for biden achieve your goals and make the situation in palestine any better?
you seem to think that voting for biden is “working with him”, which is just plain delusional. that’s completely outside of the scope of general elections. you’re not relevant to biden, or any politicians, he doesn’t know you exist, don’t think of yourself as so important that you think you’re working with them. what you’re doing is casting a vote to lessen future pain.
if biden were the only candidate, if it were a 1 party state and the only person able to run was biden, then yeah i’d agree with you. voting means nothing. but that’s simply not the case. you are genuinely either stupid or evil if you’d rather give your vote for trump rather than swallow your pride and at least vote to maintain some semblance of liberty (at least what’s left of it). a world where democrats lose the election is a world where you won’t even have the right to criticize your president, nor your government’s genocide.
bottom line is by not participating in the 2 party system in the presidential election, you’re not somehow making a morally correct decision that means you have no blood on your hands. you WILL have blood on your hands if republicans win, no matter how much you try to convince yourself that you totally owned those genociders by basically voting for the worse genocider. your view is extremely short-sighted and you care about your own pride more than the rights of LGBT people, black & hispanic people, etc.
Trump (to black Americans) in 2016: What do you have to lose?
You’re basically just spouting Trump talking points.
Trump would obviously not only support Israel’s position he would sell them more weapons…wouldn’t care at all about the Palestinian human rights angle and he would allow Russia to walk into Ukraine and that’s just the “foreign relations” plan…domestically, he’s planning on setting up concentration camps for the homeless and undocumented.
If you can’t see how Trump is worse than Biden I don’t know what to say. It should be self evident at this point that a second Trump presidency will be a disaster for the world. As far as Palestine goes, Biden has pissed off Netanyahu and there’s a whole diplomatic row unfolding right now because Biden said there has to be a two state solution and Netanyahu says no. I guess you’re unfamiliar with Trump somehow but based off his previous behavior he would be more likely to help Netanyahu and encourage him to do even worse things. Trump certainly wouldn’t be getting into a public spat where he’s insisting on a Palestinian state, he’s definitely not going to do anything to stop what Israel is doing, or even to discourage them.
I don’t believe this “row” with Netanyahu will amount to anything, which I am basing on Biden’s record of always backing Israel every single time. You and I agree about Trump. We’ve clearly come to different conclusions about Biden. I don’t think we are going to get any further in this conversation.
Also, the idea that Trump “certainly” wouldn’t get in a public spat when he is, in fact, Donald Trump and public spats are exactly his MO is fucking laughable.
I’m not saying Trump doesn’t get in public spats, just that he wouldn’t get into one with Netanyahu over Palestinian statehood. The idea of Trump arguing with Netanyahu in defense of the rights of Palestinians is absurd on its face.
Not arming the Israeli’s and letting Iran try to start a war it cannot win, which would result in a domino effect of failed middle eastern states, tens of millions of deaths, and tens of millions of war refugees.
Oh but by all means burn the fucking planet down and destroy democracy for 350,000,000 Americans because you want everyone to know how super sad you are over 25,000 avoidable deaths.
Lol it’s really funny this imaginary scenario in that person’s head… Thinking that Israel killing tens of thousands today will somehow prevent future deaths that are impossible for us to predict. If I didn’t know any better, I’d call that IDF bootlicking.
Bro I don’t care about Palestine that much right now, nothing we can do there, that’s on Israel, Iran and the middle east, you better look in your own fkn back yard because dictatorship is just around the corner while everyone is worried about the next marvel movie and causes they don’t really have any power to effect.
We’ve been selling Israel weapons while they declare exactly what they want to do. What the fuck are you talking about? Biden has gone around Congress twice to sell weapons to Israel. But sure. Nothing we can do. Get fucked.
Palestinians don’t care if Palestinians die. They huddle up around Hamas members and tunnel entrances to die as proud martyrs, human shields for their terrorist captor’s absolutely deranged anti-social and religious beliefs.
It’s very sad that 600,000 to 800,000 people in Gaza ignored the evacuation warnings or were held as voluntary and involuntary human shields by a terrorist organization. The terrorists and their patron state Iran are absolutely psyched that Kentifer got tricked into openly supporting terrorism by these otherwise easily avoidable deaths. Really, it’s very sad that Hamas has no regard for the lives of the people it falsely claims to serve.
The hard right authoritarians of the world support Hamas and call these deaths genocide; Iran, Malaysia, Brazil, Iraq, Syria, etc.
The liberal world order supports Iarael’s right to self defense; America, the EU, NATO, UK, France, Australia, Norway, Austria, Poland, Germany…even Canada.
Think about that and consider whether it not maybe you really have been tricked, why you’re siding with Iran over Canada?
okay, then welcome your next dictator Donald Trump and all that implies (Gilead like conditions, rescending civil and gender rights, requiring Christian worship or prison/execution, an end to all journalism and only Trumpian little red books where you pledge allegiance to him every day or get reported to the police)
That said, it would be a real problem if Trump won. So if that happens, I hope you’ll be willing to place the blame where it belongs: with the Democrats. They are the ones doing nothing to earn our votes. Biden isn’t even campaigning.
Biden is governing. He’s doing the job he was elected to do. Perhaps that’s enough to earn some votes? Or are votes only earnt by rallies and advertisements?
In any case, it’s completely silly to blame the Democrats for losing if you don’t vote for them yourself. If you prefer Democrats over republicans, then you have to vote for them. Even though they aren’t perfect. If you don’t vote, then it is totally unreasonable to blame anyone else for getting an undesired outcome. Not voting implies that you have no preference.
(And yet again, this is another case where ‘ranked choice’ voting / preferential / instant-runoff would make this whole situation a lot easier. USA could really use some serious electoral reform.)
I don’t currently prefer democrats over Republicans. I think they are equally harmful in different ways. What do I do? I agree that Republicans are wrong on everything, but Dems are wrong on enough things, and majorly so, that I don’t think that they can be reformed. RCV is a pipe dream for the US at large. Especially with dems in positions of power. They haven’t historically been willing to give up power once they have it.
I don’t currently prefer democrats over Republicans. I think they are equally harmful in different ways. What do I do? I agree that Republicans are wrong on everything, but Dems are wrong on enough things, and majorly so, that I don’t think that they can be reformed.
Honestly? You grow up and read some books. Start with any of Bernie’s books. As you read, try and answer why Bernie, the most popular and longest serving third party politician in history, ran for president by seeking the Democratic nomination instead of running as an independent.
The answer is that the DNC can be changed and has shifted significantly to the left in the last eight years, and will continue to do so. However if you idiotically allow Trump to win the presidency, it will likely be the last presidential election you ever get to vote. The DNC might be made illegal.
The choice is hope for the future or no hope for the future.
And Bernie failed to make any headway because the private club shut him out. How about you grow up and stop making excuses for voting for an old man who aids and abets genocide?
Vote however you want. It’s your choice. If you prefer Republicans, then vote for them. I’m just saying that if you choose not to vote for Democrats, it’s silly to then go on to blame the Democrats for Trump being in power. ‘Blame’ implies that you are unhappy with the outcome, but it is effectively an outcome that you yourself chose with your vote.
If you don’t want Trump to win, then you should choose to vote against him. If you don’t, you yourself are the one to blame. (That said, if you are happy to have that demented tyrant as your president, then go ahead and vote for him. It’s your choice.)
If Dems need my vote to win, then they need to run a candidate that doesn’t support genocide in Palestine. If they can’t or won’t do that, then they are forfeiting my vote. If they do that and lose, then they are the one’s “at fault” for losing.
Man it’s crazy how these people think they can instill some false duty onto any leftist to “do the right thing” without actually weighing each of the choices carefully. They just see a D next to someone’s name and think they must be the good guy, regardless of what they say.
Did we all forget about the kids in cages on the border? Or the lack of free healthcare/college? Did we forget about the union busting? Biden is not a good guy, he’s just barely better than Trump. He’s certainly better at hiding the heinous shit from everyone.
But yeah man, were all bad people and unamerican for wanting a better choice and hating our hand I guess?
Explain to me how being reluctant to vote for one of two presidential candidates due to their policies and global politics is immature. Am I supposed to just say “well millions will die either way but at least sleepy Joe relieved some student debt?”
What’s impractical is running a country off of the lesser of two evils vote.
As it should be. FUCKING VOTE! And remember, by not voting for Biden, you are voting for Trump whether or not you actually cast a vote. ALL of the Trump supporters WILL show up on the day.
Either way you’re voting for a Palestinian genocide and the continuation of neoliberal imperialism.
Edit: the future is bleak either way, Biden has explicitly shown support for the continuation of support for Israel as well as the bombing campaign in Yemen and Syria. All this is to say that there is genuinely nothing we can do to help the middle east in this election.
But sure, we can get a better minimum wage or whatever.
Grow up bro, we don’t care about your pet bleeding heart topic, either vote for Biden or be prepared to be persecuted in a Trumpian dictatorship.
You don’t care about Palestinian hospitals and children being firebombed? Dope.
Edit: I’m sorry but telling me to grow up while also saying the phrase “trumpian dictatorship” has gotta be one of the funniest things I’ve ever read.
me being told to grow up by another lemmy user is literally 1984 guys
Funny equals censorship complaint.
You’re a fucking retard
But only one of the genocidal imperialists will peacefully step down in 2029.
I truly don’t think that matters. If Biden wins trump is just going to claim that the election was falsified again. We’re looking at a boiling point situation with no real answer.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m probably still going to vote for Biden unfortunately. But people acting like the choice is so clear are not reading the writing on the wall.
Edit: people down voting this forgot that trump and his supporters literally have stated that if he is not in office this year, they will do more than they did on January 6th. Many of them will call for an all out civil war. The problem isn’t the end of the next term, it’s the inauguration.
If they try again to do another January 6, or if they had tried to go further last time, they would have been met with force of the US military and they would be absolutely crushed.
Also, the Civil War was organized and planned in secret, long before the NSA and FBI existed, predator drone and hellfire missiles. I don’t think another one could get far enough along to pose an existential threat.
The capital insurrection ended exactly how a 3%'r civil war would end: they’d smear a bunch of shit on the walls until one of them fucks around and finds out, and then they’ll hide their faces as they scurry away out the back door, back into their mom’s basements and motor homes.
https://www.jcs.mil/Portals/36/Documents/JCS Message to the Joint Force JAN 12 21.pdf
The same could be said for trumps proposed future attempt to remain in office. The military did not ever really side with trump.
Biden is awful, but I would take him over orange Hitler any day of the week. Heck, I would take DC’s Joker over Trump… that will put a smile on everyone’s faces.
Yeah I feel like people misunderstand what I’m saying as though I’m considering voting for trump. I’m not at all. I’m just trying to figure out how well voting for Biden sits on my conscience, or if id rather write in daffy duck this year.
Trump is not on the menu for me, and I feel like I’ve made that fairly clear but not once talking about voting for him.
Of course, no one here is seriously accusing you of voting for Trump; the thing I’m trying to say is that there are a lot of magadiots who will do everything in their power to get Trump back in the White House. There is also a lot of voter suppression in poorer neighborhoods with minorities who tend to vote blue in hopes they give up and go home, which gives republicans an advantage.
There is a very real chance Trump will win in the coming elections, so everyone who opposes Trump and what he stands for should absolutely vote for Biden even if he is awful, because if Trump is back in the White House, there is a real possibility this will be the last election.
I’m saying this as someone who was very cynical about politics for years and didn’t always vote during my life, and have come to regret not voting immensely.
I understand where you’re coming from, but I still don’t think it’s anyone’s right to tell me or anyone else that they are obligated to vote for any president.
Vote for everything else, vote in your local elections. That’s what changes things. But I don’t believe it’s my duty to vote for one of two pieces of shit every election just because of some screeching fucking retards on the Internet.
I’m not telling you you are obligated to do anything, I’m just asking you to reconsider because I’ve been there and deeply regretted not having voted in the past.
Yes, voting in local elections is probably going to make an immediate and tangible difference to your community, and should be encouraged for everyone to participate, but it’s still really important to vote in the presidential elections to keep Trump out of the White House. There is a real risk that if Trump wins in 2024, there won’t be a 2028 election at all…
No, there is no concern that the term limit will be removed or expanded. It hasn’t happened since the amendment was ratified, even after multiple attempts from politicians of various rank and from each party.
There are plenty of things to be concerned about, but the “trump will become the life long leader of the United States in his presidency” rhetoric is stupid and unfounded.
Nixon couldn’t do it, truman couldn’t do it, trump is not as competent or capable as either of these presidents. It will not happen. This is literally the same shit republicans used to say about Obama and it didn’t happen then.
He would have to convince 3/4s of the states in both the house of representatives and Congress to ratify, and there is no way he could do that.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-second_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution
No. You don’t get to tell me that I have to vote for Biden when he’s not doing anything to earn my vote. He’s allowing Israel to carry out a genocide. So he’s not actually less evil than Trump. You’re just upset because Trump’s shitty policies will impact you more than Biden’s shitty policies. Biden has the lower approval ratings than Trump did at this point. He has not earned a second term.
How about the Dems run a candidate who isn’t dog shit? I vote for Dems as a form of harm reduction, but they aren’t reducing harm anymore. So what’s in it for me? Dems haven’t not done anything about the supreme court, student loans, or threats to democracy and they are largely supporting the actions of Israel. If I’m right, and this is a genocide (I am), then voting for anyone who supports it would be an evil act. They’re going to have to make some changes if they want to earn the votes of people who don’t want to see a genocide carried out on our watch with our bombs.
That said, it would be a real problem if Trump won. So if that happens, I hope you’ll be willing to place the blame where it belongs: with the Democrats. They are the ones doing nothing to earn our votes. Biden isn’t even campaigning.
Okay. But Palestine still gonna be fucked. I get that you don’t care if Palestinians die. But I do. So I get to not vote for the guy currently enabling their genocide. “Trump would do it too” so you admit it’s bad? Demand better from your politicians you weakling.
If you think Palestine is still fucked either way then choosing to empowerer Trump makes even less sense. I think it’s a fact that Trump will be far worse for Palestinians than Biden, but even if we assume they will both be just as terrible on this issue, Trump is also terrible on every issue. If your choice is terrible and completely terrible, logically you should go with terrible. The other choice is even worse.
How could trump be worse?what is worse than arming the Israelies while they engage in genocide? Unless you don’t believe that’s what is happening. In which case,you have been misinformed. Genocide is genocide. Why am I the asshole here for not wanting to vote for someone who is enabling a genocide? Why isn’t Biden the asshole for enabling the genocide or not stepping down?
ah, so the single-issue voter. actually it’s not even single-issue, that’s just giving up status quo in order to effectively vote for worse than status quo. that’s called having a narrow view on the world, you know the middle east isn’t the only thing that exists in american politics right? there are still other things to improve on rather than just saying “oh israel-palestine conflict is going to shit either way therefore why even bother, might as well fuck up every other political issue, it’s useless if we can’t have this one win”.
grow up, you’re effectively casting all your friends and loved ones into the flames with your stubbornness, and casting palestinians into the flames considering trump is going to rail way harder against palestine than biden does. it’s not like not voting means no palestinians die, why do you have this delusion that you have blood on your hands if you vote but no blood on your hands if you don’t. it helps nobody and improves nothing except your own ego because you get to say “oh well i didn’t vote for genocide!” even though you practically voted for more genocide.
It’s not my only issue with Biden, but it is my biggest and the fact that it doesn’t even seem to register as a problem for you is very telling. You don’t care about anything that’s happening to anyone outside of the US huh? Your world is that small? Get a grip. We all draw our lines in the sand somewhere and when the line is crossed, that’s usually the thing we’re going to yell about. I think “I can work with you on anything other than genocide related crimes” is pretty fucking lenient, don’t you?
alright then my guy, what does trump do better than biden that makes you want him to win instead? because you seem so happy to give trump an extra vote. what would trump do better outside of the US since that seems to be where your concern lies? how will not voting for biden achieve your goals and make the situation in palestine any better?
you seem to think that voting for biden is “working with him”, which is just plain delusional. that’s completely outside of the scope of general elections. you’re not relevant to biden, or any politicians, he doesn’t know you exist, don’t think of yourself as so important that you think you’re working with them. what you’re doing is casting a vote to lessen future pain.
if biden were the only candidate, if it were a 1 party state and the only person able to run was biden, then yeah i’d agree with you. voting means nothing. but that’s simply not the case. you are genuinely either stupid or evil if you’d rather give your vote for trump rather than swallow your pride and at least vote to maintain some semblance of liberty (at least what’s left of it). a world where democrats lose the election is a world where you won’t even have the right to criticize your president, nor your government’s genocide.
bottom line is by not participating in the 2 party system in the presidential election, you’re not somehow making a morally correct decision that means you have no blood on your hands. you WILL have blood on your hands if republicans win, no matter how much you try to convince yourself that you totally owned those genociders by basically voting for the worse genocider. your view is extremely short-sighted and you care about your own pride more than the rights of LGBT people, black & hispanic people, etc.
Trump (to black Americans) in 2016: What do you have to lose?
You’re basically just spouting Trump talking points.
Trump would obviously not only support Israel’s position he would sell them more weapons…wouldn’t care at all about the Palestinian human rights angle and he would allow Russia to walk into Ukraine and that’s just the “foreign relations” plan…domestically, he’s planning on setting up concentration camps for the homeless and undocumented.
So he would do what Biden is doing but more… Justify voting for him however you want. Biden is just as supportive of Israel as Trump would be.
Exactly…so that’s why Trump is worse for everything including the Israel issue.
If you can’t see how Trump is worse than Biden I don’t know what to say. It should be self evident at this point that a second Trump presidency will be a disaster for the world. As far as Palestine goes, Biden has pissed off Netanyahu and there’s a whole diplomatic row unfolding right now because Biden said there has to be a two state solution and Netanyahu says no. I guess you’re unfamiliar with Trump somehow but based off his previous behavior he would be more likely to help Netanyahu and encourage him to do even worse things. Trump certainly wouldn’t be getting into a public spat where he’s insisting on a Palestinian state, he’s definitely not going to do anything to stop what Israel is doing, or even to discourage them.
I don’t believe this “row” with Netanyahu will amount to anything, which I am basing on Biden’s record of always backing Israel every single time. You and I agree about Trump. We’ve clearly come to different conclusions about Biden. I don’t think we are going to get any further in this conversation.
Also, the idea that Trump “certainly” wouldn’t get in a public spat when he is, in fact, Donald Trump and public spats are exactly his MO is fucking laughable.
I’m not saying Trump doesn’t get in public spats, just that he wouldn’t get into one with Netanyahu over Palestinian statehood. The idea of Trump arguing with Netanyahu in defense of the rights of Palestinians is absurd on its face.
Not arming the Israeli’s and letting Iran try to start a war it cannot win, which would result in a domino effect of failed middle eastern states, tens of millions of deaths, and tens of millions of war refugees.
Oh but by all means burn the fucking planet down and destroy democracy for 350,000,000 Americans because you want everyone to know how super sad you are over 25,000 avoidable deaths.
The fuck? So just let Israel kill civilians. Cool. I was wrong. You’re not a psychopath. You’re someone who would have gone along with the Nazis.
Lol it’s really funny this imaginary scenario in that person’s head… Thinking that Israel killing tens of thousands today will somehow prevent future deaths that are impossible for us to predict. If I didn’t know any better, I’d call that IDF bootlicking.
No you are incorrect. The Nazis didn’t warn anyone before doing actual carpet bombing of civilians.
Israel warns people before it bombs. Look it up.
Bro I don’t care about Palestine that much right now, nothing we can do there, that’s on Israel, Iran and the middle east, you better look in your own fkn back yard because dictatorship is just around the corner while everyone is worried about the next marvel movie and causes they don’t really have any power to effect.
We’ve been selling Israel weapons while they declare exactly what they want to do. What the fuck are you talking about? Biden has gone around Congress twice to sell weapons to Israel. But sure. Nothing we can do. Get fucked.
Palestinians don’t care if Palestinians die. They huddle up around Hamas members and tunnel entrances to die as proud martyrs, human shields for their terrorist captor’s absolutely deranged anti-social and religious beliefs.
It’s very sad that 600,000 to 800,000 people in Gaza ignored the evacuation warnings or were held as voluntary and involuntary human shields by a terrorist organization. The terrorists and their patron state Iran are absolutely psyched that Kentifer got tricked into openly supporting terrorism by these otherwise easily avoidable deaths. Really, it’s very sad that Hamas has no regard for the lives of the people it falsely claims to serve.
The hard right authoritarians of the world support Hamas and call these deaths genocide; Iran, Malaysia, Brazil, Iraq, Syria, etc.
The liberal world order supports Iarael’s right to self defense; America, the EU, NATO, UK, France, Australia, Norway, Austria, Poland, Germany…even Canada.
Think about that and consider whether it not maybe you really have been tricked, why you’re siding with Iran over Canada?
You are a genocide apologist and I hope you live to feel the shame you deserve to feel.
okay, then welcome your next dictator Donald Trump and all that implies (Gilead like conditions, rescending civil and gender rights, requiring Christian worship or prison/execution, an end to all journalism and only Trumpian little red books where you pledge allegiance to him every day or get reported to the police)
And I will thank dems for running centrists while Gilead kills me for a trans queer person. Dems aren’t helping prevent Gilead as much as you think.
Biden is governing. He’s doing the job he was elected to do. Perhaps that’s enough to earn some votes? Or are votes only earnt by rallies and advertisements?
In any case, it’s completely silly to blame the Democrats for losing if you don’t vote for them yourself. If you prefer Democrats over republicans, then you have to vote for them. Even though they aren’t perfect. If you don’t vote, then it is totally unreasonable to blame anyone else for getting an undesired outcome. Not voting implies that you have no preference.
(And yet again, this is another case where ‘ranked choice’ voting / preferential / instant-runoff would make this whole situation a lot easier. USA could really use some serious electoral reform.)
Also, what if I don’t think Biden did what I elected him to do?
I don’t currently prefer democrats over Republicans. I think they are equally harmful in different ways. What do I do? I agree that Republicans are wrong on everything, but Dems are wrong on enough things, and majorly so, that I don’t think that they can be reformed. RCV is a pipe dream for the US at large. Especially with dems in positions of power. They haven’t historically been willing to give up power once they have it.
Honestly? You grow up and read some books. Start with any of Bernie’s books. As you read, try and answer why Bernie, the most popular and longest serving third party politician in history, ran for president by seeking the Democratic nomination instead of running as an independent.
The answer is that the DNC can be changed and has shifted significantly to the left in the last eight years, and will continue to do so. However if you idiotically allow Trump to win the presidency, it will likely be the last presidential election you ever get to vote. The DNC might be made illegal.
The choice is hope for the future or no hope for the future.
And Bernie failed to make any headway because the private club shut him out. How about you grow up and stop making excuses for voting for an old man who aids and abets genocide?
Vote however you want. It’s your choice. If you prefer Republicans, then vote for them. I’m just saying that if you choose not to vote for Democrats, it’s silly to then go on to blame the Democrats for Trump being in power. ‘Blame’ implies that you are unhappy with the outcome, but it is effectively an outcome that you yourself chose with your vote.
If you don’t want Trump to win, then you should choose to vote against him. If you don’t, you yourself are the one to blame. (That said, if you are happy to have that demented tyrant as your president, then go ahead and vote for him. It’s your choice.)
If Dems need my vote to win, then they need to run a candidate that doesn’t support genocide in Palestine. If they can’t or won’t do that, then they are forfeiting my vote. If they do that and lose, then they are the one’s “at fault” for losing.
Man it’s crazy how these people think they can instill some false duty onto any leftist to “do the right thing” without actually weighing each of the choices carefully. They just see a D next to someone’s name and think they must be the good guy, regardless of what they say.
Did we all forget about the kids in cages on the border? Or the lack of free healthcare/college? Did we forget about the union busting? Biden is not a good guy, he’s just barely better than Trump. He’s certainly better at hiding the heinous shit from everyone.
But yeah man, were all bad people and unamerican for wanting a better choice and hating our hand I guess?
Not unAmerica, just impractical and immature.
Explain to me how being reluctant to vote for one of two presidential candidates due to their policies and global politics is immature. Am I supposed to just say “well millions will die either way but at least sleepy Joe relieved some student debt?”
What’s impractical is running a country off of the lesser of two evils vote.