I don’t get it. Her music is sometimes catchy but otherwise unremarkable, from the songs I’ve heard. How does she break all these records and accumulate so much fame and wealth?
She’s pretty, but a lot of singer songwriters are, especially those with makeup and costume people, a support staff.
Is there something else to her that people like?
I’m confused about what makes her so apparently unique or phenomenal.
Update: there are so many things that make swift unique or phenomenal.
I’ve received tons of great answers from people that have helped me understand, like piecing together a jigsaw puzzle, many factors that makes swift different and consequently more successful than her peers.
Clever lyrics, top-tier production, sharing autobiographical and emotional points in her life very directly, apparent honesty with few or no public blemishes, creating a community of fans through Easter eggs and house parties and unconventional, but always personal methods, an early start supported by wealthy parents, she keeps winning against abusers, and her music itself is popular and fun.
Those are just a few of the puzzle pieces contributed here, and a dive into this post is a pretty good explanation of many of the factors that must be contributing to her phenomenal success and recognition, that set her apart from other pop stars, even pop stars who were phenoms in their own right.
This is a very educational post, thank you to everyone who has contributed.
Think of a dish made by a world class chef, that food is probably exquisitely crafted using unique and fresh ingredients. There probably aren’t that many people out there who truly appreciate it, and probably a lot who just think it’s weird.
Now think of pizza. It’s relatively cheap and broadly appealing. It wouldn’t be put in the same class as the food prepared by the chef, but a lot more of it gets consumed.
Taylor Swift is talented, pretty, affable, has a superior work ethic, and makes music that’s catchy and easily digestible. Like pizza, her music appeals to the broadest group of people.
I like this explanation, but I feel like there are plenty of other artists who fit into that category.
Is it just random that they had to pick one brand of pizza to go crazy over do you think?
The pizza has been carefully crafted by teams of experts to appeal to the largest audience.
As someone who couldn’t name a single Swift song up until a couple of months ago — From what I read she writes the vast majority of her songs, which is exceptionally rare for pop stars; especially from such a young age… The songs may be simplistic and formulaic, but the lyrics are decent for the age they were written at, and the work ethic and genre jumping is impressive. The most admirable thing about her is how she’s screwing venture capitalists by re-recording all the songs she wrote. I hope she starts redistributing all that wealth she’s extracting.
Ok just don’t forget she came from money and had opportunities:
She traveled there with her mother at age eleven to visit record labels
Dunno any of her new stuff, but I’d be surprised if you’ve never heard any of the following as they were very overplayed, even though they are good:
Teardrops from my guitar
Love story
Our song
Blank space
You belong with me
She is a damn fine businesswoman. She was able to use social media to have a relationship with her followers and build a large audience. That’s one of the main reasons she became famous.
Also, there have been a couple of situations that benefited her fame, such as the Kanye incident
Thanks
Luck and timing are big factors. There are many talented artists out there that work hard and make the kind of music that (in theory) should appeal to a large audience but never make it. Either at all or not to the level of Taylor Swift. If you make the right music at the right time, your chances increase but you still need luck.
Edit: what I’ve heard of Taylor is that she’s very good in making the right music at the right time. The songs fit the trends in music. But I’ve never listened much to her, so I don’t know for sure if its correct
Thanks, someone else compared her to other pop stars like Michael Jackson and Madonna, and all of those people were at the forefront of their particular movement.
I feel like Taylor Swift is just in the middle of all the other pop stars.
Appreciate it, I’m going to try and look into it from that perspective, maybe I just don’t understand the music world at all. I definitely don’t.
I just remembered a big factor as to why artists such as Madonna have a long career: they managed to appeal to the queer crowd, who tend to be fiercely dedicated to anyone who stands up for them.
Don’t forget the money and connections. IIRC her father literally bought(?) or created(?) a label to sign her. There a lot more talented artists out there but she had the money and connections that gave her a very big headstart. Talent can only get you so far in the industry. It’s luck/timing and money/connections that allow you to break through.
My brother is a swiftie and seems to think that her talent is above and beyond a standard artists talent. One thing that is praised is how much range she has covered across her albums.
I’m personally not a fan, and to me she seems overrated, but I also have to recognize the mass following and legitimate consistency in the music quality. She’s not like a Katy Perry recycling the same tune.
So I think she’s like a really nice pizza, appealing but always good quality, always fresh.
A couple people have mentioned her range, but they also only mention her relationship and breakup songs. What else does she sing about that gives her range?
She might not recycle the same tune, but it kinda seems like she recycles the same themes verbatim. I’d say she’s closer to Papa John’s than a good quality pizza shop. Her music is probably good, but I doubt that it’s usually great.
You have to explore all her albums in order to really form that opinion. People who like that kind of music will do so, and likely decide that she is phenomenal.
But then folks like you and me will not want to take time to ingest all that music that doesn’t appeal to us, so we have to speculate based off what we get exposed to which is generally her pop songs on the radio and such. But we aren’t really getting the full Taylor Swift. So it’s like we’re judging a sample of her stuff (which sounds like a lot of other pop cuz all pop sounds basically the same) and oversimplify what she offers to music.
I’m completely speculating… Like I said we’d have to dive into all those albums and listen to really form a meaningful opinion.
That’s a fair opinion. I usually don’t listen to albums, even for creators I like, so it didn’t really click that her most famous works might not be why people like her.
That being said, there were a few (probably cherrypicked) clips of her concerts where she said something “inspirational” (or quirky?), and her fans go absolutely insane, and to me it just sounds like the most mundane stuff you could say. So until I listen to her stuff I’ll keep my existing impression.
She’s smart and not lazy. A lot of people get fame and money and massively shift their focus. Longevity is probably the toughest part, not going crazy, and remaining relatable to young people while simultaneously having millions of dollars.
She’s pretty and blond as well… oh, and white.
It’s like Britney all over again.
But way way bigger and with way more awards. And records.
And smarter, a lot smarter than Britney.
Does this take any effort though?
What, being smart?
Being smarter than Britney.
Smart, pretty, rich parents in positions to boost her early career, generic songs that young women and girls everywhere can project their own issues onto, blonde and white, early career (and again, blonde pretty and white) made her more popular with the country crowd, tons of luck…
Talent can only get you so far.
What is Taylor’s ‘Toxic’ though?
That girl invests in real estate, she’s not stupid enough to make a song like that.
How fucking dare you. That’s an absolute banger.
Just kidding, yeah it’s a good song.
Just like pizza, artist go off after a while. (It just takes longer)
Except for all of the artists who don’t.
And a lot of the artists who do “go off” don’t get 81 awards in a decade and a half.
Those aren’t to many. I can’t name many though that made good music 2 decades ago and still do. Only the Stones spring to mind. I never even heard of Taylor Swift until last year.
Is she NY style or deep dish?
St. Louis
The world class chef can only cook for a few at a time. Digital distribution means big voice.
-Very skilled songwriter. I don’t necessarily like all her stuff but I legitimately think she’s the best songwriter (meaning, composing music and writing lyrics) of her generation. Probably since Bruce Springsteen or Billy Joel.
-Very attractive and a good performer
-Well connected in the music industry let her get an early start/inside track
-obsessed with being popular. I don’t mean that in a negative way, but her primary objective with her music is to please as many people as possible. I think the documentary “Miss Americana” on Netflix explains that very well-at one point she straight up says “I just want people to like me” or something like that. That means her music/career has always focused on mass appeal as opposed to making more… limited-appeal music like most artists do at some point in their career
-she’s kept a remarkably clean image even through being famous for close to two decades. It’s very telling that the worst thing her haters can say about her is “but her plane uses a lot of carbon!” This means parents let kids listen to her, brands love her as a sponsor, nobody boycotts her, etc.
-one last thing, I think people love her songs because they feel like they’re true. Her songs have a very intimate, almost confessional quality that a lot of artists strive for buy often comes off as fake.
She’s just lately a decent songwriter. For most of her career, her songs were written for her by the heavy hitters behind virtually every top 100 hit. Her producer/mixer/writer Jack Antonoff still does most of the heavy lifting.
I am tired of seeing the sentiment that she’s some brilliant songwriter–she really only kind of plays the guitar. The reality is that if anyone is made to be a billionaire, and work with one of the best musical minds of our time (Antonoff), and collaborate with the other top song writers/ghost writers, of course, a decade later, they’ll be able to write songs. It was never some innate talent of hers, or else the songs she truly did write early in her career would have been the hits, instead of the mutually agreed upon worst on the album.
By early in her career do you mean when she was like 18? I’m not saying she hasn’t had a lot of help. But I disagree with the idea that she’s just a figurehead. She is listed as a writer for pretty much all her songs, and you can usually tell a Taylor Swift song just by the sound/lyrics, which isnt something i can say for a lot of pop artists. If it was Antonoff the whole time then Bleachers would be more popular (relative to Swift).
No, she really only started to write with “Lover”. Prior to that, it was Antonoff, and prior to that it was a lot of different writers/ghost writers.
I also don’t think she’s just a figure head. I appreciate everything she’s done to get artists paid more, I think she’s a good role model for girls/women, etc. But, I do not think she’s a talented song writer. She’s not a multi-instrumentalist. And, she is a billionaire, hoarding wealth like all the others.
Thanks! Those are all interesting points and I have never heard of that documentary but love documentaries, so I’ll definitely be checking that out.
Especially since you’re the first person who’s mentioned how much she wants to be popular, or how much she is focused on that.
That’s very interesting and obviously seems very relevant, thanks.
Not just that, but Republicans hating her so much made her even more popular.
I think people love her songs because they feel like they’re true
Her very first hit was about being a farmer’s daughter.
And Tom Clancy was never a Russian submarine captain or spy
Do people like Tom Clancy novels because “they feel like they’re true”?
Sorry if you missed the point, but what I intended to say is that, artists frequently create pieces that they haven’t actually experienced.
Your point was completely obvious but Tom Clancy was a very poor choice to illustrate that point. Of course some artists produce works that have an essence of truth despite being fiction; perhaps Taylor Swift is such an artist, but Tom Clancy definitely isn’t.
Fair, I was going to say look at “I was only 19” by red gum, but that wouldn’t work for an international audience, so I tried to go with a non fantasy author that is recognisable
Not sure what song that is off the top of my head, but I didn’t mean “true” in the literal sense. More like, people feel like the songs give them a glimpse of the real Taylor swift. That’s particularly true of her more recent albums I feel like. For example, “Folklore” is told largely through stories about other (fictional) people, but it feels like a reflection of emotions and experiences she really has been through. It’s all very parasocial and I’m not sure how much of it is genuine, but my point is it FEELS genuine.
In a word: marketing. In two words: relentless marketing.
Her dad owned the record company. They are rich. $$$$
Best answer in the thread
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The reason is that her dad is quite rich and was a stock broker.
He invested heavily in the label that had his daughter under contract, being able to dictate what the label was focusing on and on top he has thrown another Million on her, to start the journey.
So to sum it up a huge tone of money, contacts and knowledge about how to run a business by her father.
Oh shnit, I didn’t even know about this. Okay that explains at least a bit.
Thanks.
Label*
You’re right. Ups :P
Two n’s in tonne.
The music industry has been a racket for nearly 100 years. Music doesn’t get popular because people like it, it gets popular because it’s promoted. Way back when, promoters would pay radio stations to play their music to encourage sales. The methods are slightly different now, but it’s still the same kind of old boy’s club telling people what they like.
Taylor Swift understood the industry she was getting into, and was very adept at exploiting it.
This is true, but not everything that gets promoted gets popular. A lot also flunks.
Taylor Swift just happens to hit a sweet spot that appeals to a lot of people.
And music has a self-reinforcing spiral. People listen to music from artists that they like, and which their peers like.
So a popular artist could theoretically release an album without any promotion and it would still become popular, just because people will be curious to listen to the new songs from an artist that they already like (of course, record labels will always heavily promote work from their popular artists to make them even more popular).
She appeals to a lot of people because she followed the script of what has been established as appealing to a lot of people, what people have been trained to like. It’s the same manufactured crap that has always been promoted, the difference is she’s an artist that knows what that is, rather than the artist being directed that way.
I’m not a huge fan or anything, but I think she’s a really talented musician and really good at managing her fame. She keeps a strong relationship with her fans, her music spans numerous genres, and her father is a wealth manager.
Watching her Tiny Desk concert helped me get more into her music so I could enjoy it with my daughter.
Very cool, thanks for the recommendation, I love those tiny desk concerts. I’ll watch it
I’ll sum up some answers that made things click for me
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She writes songs spanning many emotions.
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Her albums span multiple genres. (I’ve only heard pop and country, but I’m not a fan.)
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She is hard working, prolific, and puts on a show.
So with that combination it seems she has something for everyone. Personally, I only know one TS song, but it’s catchy as hell. So there’s no song that I hate that happens to TS song either.
About point 2.: I’m a Paul Simon fan and he spans multiple genres, but I wouldn’t expect non-fans to know that.
I’ve also only heard her pop, although i keep hearing that she spans multiple genre.
I’ll ask the next Swifty that responds that they would recommend in any other genre besides relationship pop, break up pop.
Thanks, and the Paul Simon note is interesting. What do I listen to if I’m curious about listening to unconventional Paul Simon?
The Paul Simon I’m definitely not familiar with.
I’m not a music expert but here goes.
Paul Simon is most identified as folk. The act Simon and Garfunkel is basically pure folk if such a thing exists.
Listen to the opening of Late in the Evening. He’s singing folk, but there is no guitar (to my ear). Instead it’s a bass guitar playing funk. Later some horns come in. They sound like mambo to me.
There are two songs on Graceland that he recorded with a South African band. This was during apartheid. He heard a bootleg tape from this SA group, and had to travel to a part of South Africa that he was banned from doing business in.
Does he make it some powerful statement? No, that would be a stunt. He just wanted to make music with them. “I Know What I Know” is about the insipid-ness of show biz party-networking culture. It’s wild.
Awesome, thanks. Yeah, I only know about him as folk so I’m interested to listen to these.
Don’t get me wrong, he is a folk singer. But listening to what he is singing over can catch you off-guard.
Appreciate it, cool
She started in country music and moved to mostly pop from there, a lot of her original country music is about breakups too but that’s pretty typical for women in country music because they don’t get much freedom of movement for topics there unless they’re hyper famous.
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Kanye interrupted her acceptance speech with some crazy shit.
From there on, it was just maintaining the momentum.
I do think this is a good point, that she got a cultural relevance boost from this.
And all these years later, Jay Z was just complaining on stage that his wife should have won Album of the year after Taylor won it again.
great marketing
Peak reddi … I mean lemmy.
Your comment is peak reddit tho
Got me!
-3500. Making more progress!
Imagine stalking someone on the Internet because you don’t like their opinions 🤣
Right noticing some douche keeps reappearing who has -3500 karma – definitely StAlKiNg
Wait, you can see user karma on Lemmy? When I click on a profile it doesn’t appear anywhere. It must be invisible to me since I’m just using the website.
It shows on the profile page in Boost but yeah you’re right, on the web UI it’s not a thing.
Your just keep on showing up in my comments 🤷♂️
I just wanna cheer you on. -4000 here we go!!
I’m definitely not a swiftie, but she does have some catchy music, and Shake it off was the default song for getting my kids out of bad moods and over bad days.
I also used to think she was a catty bitch for the way she was caught on camera making a face when Selena Gomez was with Bieber. However since then I’ve heard her speak about things she cares about and I appreciate her passion and that she’s against the things I’m generally against, she definitely seems to care and motivate her swifties to care about the right things, and that makes me tend to support her.
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Listening to her speak as a public figure is a good idea, I’ll look for some interviews. Thanks
Just commenting to let you know that you are not alone in your confusion.
To me, most of her songs are pleasant but forgetable.
She seems like just one of many female Pop artists with a bit of girl-next-door charm. Maybe that charm is her appeal?
Maybe she is a witch?
Who knows.
That’s the thing, I would just think “current pop sensation” but she seems way more successful and receives so many more awards than other pop artists.
It’s somewhat shocking.
Probably a witch
Besides listening to her when she is on the radio from time to time, Taylor Swift was forever carved in my mind when she agreed to have a (now classic) duet with a goat.
You’re right, this marks her as a great.
I honestly don’t know. What I do know, though, is that her fanbase is weird and likes putting curses on people. No joke.
Weird keeps things interesting and curses are make believe, so if it’s fun for them, no harm no foul.
Because she’s not only good at producing the right music, she’s good at business and has the right connections to launch them.
Thanks, I’m very curious about this. What are some salient examples of her business prowess?
My favorite…
Guy owns her masters.
Taylor says “can I buy my master’s?”
Guy says “nope”
Taylor says “ok” then then re-records all of those albums again in a complete “fuck you”
Yeah, that is about as pop-boss as it gets, especially for someone who doesn’t need to do it.
I’m with you dude, she has a completely unremarkable to me as well.
In terms of her songs and dancing, definitely.
But I really think this threat has pointed out why she’s so successful.
Squeaky clean image so she can be played everywhere, great marketing, high production, clever lyrics, a lot of community outreach, autobiographical social media and songs, and I finally understand why people talk about her business acumen after I listened to a podcast about her eras tour and how much was self produced.
She’s knocking it out of the park on every front she can while focusing solely on the music industry.
Definitely an interesting phenomenon.
I’m still not wild about her music, but I was very curious how someone so young can become so successful when she sounds so similar to all of the other artists I’ve grown up listening to.
