Any moment now, the ‘don’t vote for Biden’ group will be in here telling us not to vote for Harris. And if it isn’t Harris, they’ll tell us not to vote for whoever it is.
Anything but stop the dictator and his plan to commit genocide against Latinos and queer people.
Even if Trump wasn’t going to do awful things, I can’t stand his stupid face or his stupid voice or his stupid stupidity. That’s enough to vote for someone who’ll beat him.
Get out of my head. I only watch late night talk shows on Youtube now just so I can skip past any Trump video. I hate that guy so much it makes my jaw hurt whenever I see his image.
No. It absolutely isn’t. I was too young to vote in the 2000 election, but Gore had the same stupid face, long drawn out speech paterns, and general unlikability.
However, his policies, and his message were good. I would have voted for him despite his stupid face, because of him being the better candidate.
I FULLY understand people hating trump…but I underatand the hate because trump is a piece of shit. I get why trump is hated for his bad policies. I get why people hate having a criminal in the white house.
But to say that if a candidate were good for the position, but you hate their face and voice, I wouldn’t understand that.
Yeah but Gore did win that election. It was stolen from him. Just like Bernie won the DNC nomination and it was stolen from him. Fuck the DNC. But fuck the RNC harder.
This is the kind of comment that makes me angry, while I agree with all of it. It’s a weird feeling to be yelling “YEAH I AGREE WITH THAT!!! RAAAAHHH!!!”
And not just genocide overseas. Trump has made his position on immigrants and queer people very clear. And if anyone thinks ‘immigrants’ won’t include brown people that are native-born citizens who don’t happen to have the right ID on them, you’re wrong.
You wanna know how to shut those people up? Replace First Past The Post voting with something like Ranked Choice voting. Then they would have to make their own party and show us how it’s done. (No spoiler effect to)
I may be a weirdo, but I was on the “I’d consider not voting for Biden.” but I’m currently more interested in Harris. Nowhere near as bad of a track record as Biden had. From being racist, to supporting rapists getting into the Supreme Court, to backing massive removal of constitutional rights.
Harris’ record isn’t perfect, and while I’m in California, I don’t recall any bills she pushed/voted for as Senator that was anything as bad as the USA PATRIOT Act. I don’t like her record as our AG at all, but Senator is a different story.
If she picks a good VP pick, I’d be down. I’m wanting maybe Newsom, but that’s just he biggest Democrat I know, as he’s my Governor.
Edit: I don’t know how to make it clear: I live in California. If I voted for a ham sandwich for oresident it would have the same impact as voting for Biden. My state’s EC is clear and chosen, and popular vote doesn’t decide the president otherwise we’d never have Trump. I was considering going Greens, but I’m looking forward to Harris. Get mad at undecideds in Swing States and Trump supporters, not a registered Democrat in California.
A very common position among the lemmy crowd, unfortunately. I really don’t expect much to change either, just swap Harris for Biden in the hit pieces.
I don’t know how to make it clear: I live in California. If I voted for a ham sandwich for president it would have the same impact as voting for Biden. My state’s EC is clear and chosen, and popular vote doesn’t decide the president otherwise we’d never have Trump. I was considering going Greens, but I’m looking forward to Harris. Get mad at undecideds in Swing States and Trump supporters, not a registered Democrat in California.
I’m trying to. I live in the district Kevin McCarthy was in. His replacement isn’t great. Our blanket primary was “Republican backed by Kevin and Trump” and “Republican backed by conservative think tanks and Trump staff”.
I’ve considered running for office using a form of leftist talks masked like Republican talking points. But an openly queer leftist in Republican territory won’t go well, unless I figure out what urn I want ahead of time.
How is she a good candidate? She stood against everything progressives stand for as a prosecutor and hasn’t apologized or clarified that she supports marijuana legalization, abolition of for-profit prisons, or disproportionately prosecuting minorities.
What the fuck are you talking about? When she was running for president in 2019, she released detailed plans about how she would legalize marijuana, abolish private prisons, and reform the carceral system.
I get that you probably weren’t aware of her evolved stance on these things, but a single google search could have shown you that you were incorrect on every single point you made.
What the fuck are you talking about? When she was running for president in 2019, she released detailed plans about how she would legalize marijuana, abolish private prisons, and reform the carceral system.
Has she done those things? (I sincerely don’t know.)
I’ve heard that she’s revised her stances, but even in 2019 there was some question regarding the sincerity of her evolving viewpoints.
We’re likely to get 8 years of her if she wins, so I think it’s entirely reasonable to want her to affirm her stances in some of these areas. We won’t be able to move any further left than she allows. Sure, she’s not Trump, and I’m going to vote for her. It would be nice to have hope she’ll do more than just move right more slowly than Trump though.
She says very little, and nothing convincing, about some of the most serious charges against her, like that she fought hard to keep innocents in prison and failed to fight hard against corrupt cops.
If elected president, Harris seems as likely as any of her Democratic rivals, and far more likely than Donald Trump, to pursue a criminal-justice-reform agenda that overlaps with policies I favor as a civil libertarian. And I do not hold it against Harris that as a municipal and state official she enforced many laws that I regard as unjust. All the candidates now running for president will, if elected, preside over the enforcement of some laws that they and I regard as unjust.
But like her rivals, the reforms that Harris would sign into law as president would depend mostly on what Democrats in Congress could get to her desk. Far more important is how she would preside over a federal legal system and bureaucracy that is prone to frequent abuses. And her record casts significant doubts about whether she can be trusted to oversee federal law enforcement, the military, intelligence agencies, the detention of foreign prisoners, and more.
Harris “put over 1,500 people in jail for marijuana violations and then laughed about it when she was asked if she ever smoked marijuana.”
Notably, the figures dropped dramatically during Harris’ tenure, from 817 marijuana-related admissions in her first year in office to 137 in her last.
She laughed because it was funny and I’m tired of people telling me it’s not. 💥 🔫
She’s been a prosecutor, senator, and now VP. She has the experience. She can speak in complete sentences. She is a neo-liberal but that was a given. All Democratic candidates since Clinton have been neo-liberals. The idea that Kamala is anti-progressive is false.
Cool strawman you’re beating up. I think the majority of us that didn’t want Biden is because he didn’t have a good path to victory. We didn’t want to just stand by and watch the train wreck happen. Harris isn’t much better, but at least she is better, and I will be on board with that of that’s who is chosen. I would rather see Whitmer be on the top of the ticket though.
Any moment now, the ‘don’t vote for Biden’ group will be in here telling us not to vote for Harris. And if it isn’t Harris, they’ll tell us not to vote for whoever it is.
The criterion is very simple: Don’t vote for genocide committers, enablers or planners. That excludes Biden and Trump.
If the Dems manage to produce a non genocide loving candidate, then vote vote vote and drag everyone who will vote for the non genocide candidate to the polling station.
“I’d rather let someone who actively, aggressively advocates, enables, and wants genocide domestically and abroad to win the presidency, over voting for somebody who passively enables genocide to happen abroad because actively trying to stop it could ignite WWIII” is still a bad take.
It is hypocritical to delude yourself into believing voting for genocide is somehow not approving genocide. And i hardly doubt that stopping Israel from committing genocide in Gaza would ignite WW3.
If you mistake it for Ukraine, think about all the help Ukraine is not getting so Israel can get it instead. Dozens of Billions in Weapons to slaughter a civillian population instead of helping Ukraine defend itself against Russias invasion.
I’m not deluding myself about anything. The choice isn’t “vote for or against genocide” it’s “act to get less or more genocide”. It’s not a false dichotomy; if you’re not voting to defeat Trump, then you’re acting to get more genocide.
By not acting to defeat Trump, you’re enabling genocide more than Biden ever has.
In some takes on the trolley problem (do nothing, five people are run over by a trolley an die, flip a track change switch and two people are run over by a trolley and die) flipping the switch is the morally worse option because then those two people’s deaths are your fault, whereas the five people who die because you did nothing are someone else’s fault. I don’t agree with that take, but it’s taken seriously in philosophy circles.
I don’t get how in the Levant, where both Hamas and the Israelis have significant factions that want to genocide the other people, a situation where Hamas does the genociding (because an Israel without attack capability de facto also loses defense capability) is somehow more moral than a situation where Israel does it.
You are making multiple false assumptions in there. The first being that 2.000 pound bombs are somehow “defensive”. The next being that a 30.000 fighters Hamas would somehow genocide all of the settlers, despite their army having hundreds of thousands of members. Then it goes further with this idea, that they want to eradicate them, when all they want is to get their land back. The settlers always have the options to leave and go back to their home countries. Meanwhile Israel as a settler colonial project has to commit genocide to complete itself because as long as a Palestinian people exists, it will demand to get back to its rightful land. Finally you are wrong about the reasons why people in Palestine support violence. They do so, because it is the only thing protecting them from annihilation. For Israelis it is a mix between believing, they need to commit genocide as being the perpetrator protects them from being the victims, classic imperialist greed and a big portion of racism and fascism.
But in the end Israel will destroy itself from within as all fascist states do eventually. The question is how many more people the US helps them to murder in the meantime.
![[Mega thread] - Biden ends bid for presidency](https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/9a2dc393-619f-4874-875e-80b5d90ecd3b.png){kind=link}
Any moment now, the ‘don’t vote for Biden’ group will be in here telling us not to vote for Harris. And if it isn’t Harris, they’ll tell us not to vote for whoever it is.
Anything but stop the dictator and his plan to commit genocide against Latinos and queer people.
Even if Trump wasn’t going to do awful things, I can’t stand his stupid face or his stupid voice or his stupid stupidity. That’s enough to vote for someone who’ll beat him.
Get out of my head. I only watch late night talk shows on Youtube now just so I can skip past any Trump video. I hate that guy so much it makes my jaw hurt whenever I see his image.
Edit: I wish I could vote against him.
Are you unable to vote against him because you’re not American?
Yup.
Ah. Legally speaking, that’s a pretty good excuse.
No. It absolutely isn’t. I was too young to vote in the 2000 election, but Gore had the same stupid face, long drawn out speech paterns, and general unlikability.
However, his policies, and his message were good. I would have voted for him despite his stupid face, because of him being the better candidate.
I FULLY understand people hating trump…but I underatand the hate because trump is a piece of shit. I get why trump is hated for his bad policies. I get why people hate having a criminal in the white house.
But to say that if a candidate were good for the position, but you hate their face and voice, I wouldn’t understand that.
Yeah but Gore did win that election. It was stolen from him. Just like Bernie won the DNC nomination and it was stolen from him. Fuck the DNC. But fuck the RNC harder.
This is the kind of comment that makes me angry, while I agree with all of it. It’s a weird feeling to be yelling “YEAH I AGREE WITH THAT!!! RAAAAHHH!!!”
It was stolen from us.
Nah, Gore is not nearly as stupid as Trump, either in face, voice, or thought.
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It’s pretty logical and common for US to support Israel no matter what
Yes and that’s high key horrifying. However it’s not a majority opinion https://news.gallup.com/poll/642695/majority-disapprove-israeli-action-gaza.aspx
That doesn’t really matter that it’s a majority opinion. Cause average people don’t really care about US’s strategic interests in the middle east.
I’m really hoping if Harris still has to be on the ticket that she’ll stay VP. It would be nice to have a decent prez option.
But I’ll be voting anti trump either way.
Absolutely they will. When the gEnOciDe stopped working/got boring, they switched to- oLd!
Give it a day, they’ll have their reasons not to vote for her too.
Someone already replied to me saying that unless the Democrats produce a “non genocide-loving candidate,” don’t vote for them.
conveniently making room for the one candidate who probably does love a genocide
And not just genocide overseas. Trump has made his position on immigrants and queer people very clear. And if anyone thinks ‘immigrants’ won’t include brown people that are native-born citizens who don’t happen to have the right ID on them, you’re wrong.
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Of course they did. Because MAGA won’t be happy until there are no democratic voters.
No democracy either. They want an authoritarian dictatorship because they don’t believe they’ll be the ones hurt by it.
Bots bots and more bots. I assume all of that garbage is coming from a room full of shoulder to shoulder ruskies
I tend to go by Hanlon’s Razor unless given reason to do otherwise.
Harris isn’t ideal, but she’s an improvement. She’s less on board with genocide than Bidenyahu, and she can fog a mirror.
Vote for Harris. Don’t make the party regret listening.
Hi, I think you’ve seen me in enough places saying not to vote for Biden.
Go vote for Harris.
You wanna know how to shut those people up? Replace First Past The Post voting with something like Ranked Choice voting. Then they would have to make their own party and show us how it’s done. (No spoiler effect to)
Nothing will shut them up. They want to find reasons to be upset about not getting their pony.
I may be a weirdo, but I was on the “I’d consider not voting for Biden.” but I’m currently more interested in Harris. Nowhere near as bad of a track record as Biden had. From being racist, to supporting rapists getting into the Supreme Court, to backing massive removal of constitutional rights.
Harris’ record isn’t perfect, and while I’m in California, I don’t recall any bills she pushed/voted for as Senator that was anything as bad as the USA PATRIOT Act. I don’t like her record as our AG at all, but Senator is a different story.
If she picks a good VP pick, I’d be down. I’m wanting maybe Newsom, but that’s just he biggest Democrat I know, as he’s my Governor.
Edit: I don’t know how to make it clear: I live in California. If I voted for a ham sandwich for oresident it would have the same impact as voting for Biden. My state’s EC is clear and chosen, and popular vote doesn’t decide the president otherwise we’d never have Trump. I was considering going Greens, but I’m looking forward to Harris. Get mad at undecideds in Swing States and Trump supporters, not a registered Democrat in California.
you were considering not voting for Biden when Trump was the alternative?
A very common position among the lemmy crowd, unfortunately. I really don’t expect much to change either, just swap Harris for Biden in the hit pieces.
I don’t know how to make it clear: I live in California. If I voted for a ham sandwich for president it would have the same impact as voting for Biden. My state’s EC is clear and chosen, and popular vote doesn’t decide the president otherwise we’d never have Trump. I was considering going Greens, but I’m looking forward to Harris. Get mad at undecideds in Swing States and Trump supporters, not a registered Democrat in California.
CA still has republicans in congress so please still vote.
I’m trying to. I live in the district Kevin McCarthy was in. His replacement isn’t great. Our blanket primary was “Republican backed by Kevin and Trump” and “Republican backed by conservative think tanks and Trump staff”.
I’ve considered running for office using a form of leftist talks masked like Republican talking points. But an openly queer leftist in Republican territory won’t go well, unless I figure out what urn I want ahead of time.
Well keep on fighting. 😊
Even if we lose in 2024, we keep fighting.
I didn’t want to believe it but they’re already in the comments. We need to be vocal. Kamala is a great candidate.
How is she a good candidate? She stood against everything progressives stand for as a prosecutor and hasn’t apologized or clarified that she supports marijuana legalization, abolition of for-profit prisons, or disproportionately prosecuting minorities.
Are you new to the democratic party?
Let me ask you a question: Harris Or Trump?
Harris, 100% I was wrong about the statement. She evolved her stance and has grown.
What the fuck are you talking about? When she was running for president in 2019, she released detailed plans about how she would legalize marijuana, abolish private prisons, and reform the carceral system.
I get that you probably weren’t aware of her evolved stance on these things, but a single google search could have shown you that you were incorrect on every single point you made.
Has she done those things? (I sincerely don’t know.)
I’ve heard that she’s revised her stances, but even in 2019 there was some question regarding the sincerity of her evolving viewpoints.
We’re likely to get 8 years of her if she wins, so I think it’s entirely reasonable to want her to affirm her stances in some of these areas. We won’t be able to move any further left than she allows. Sure, she’s not Trump, and I’m going to vote for her. It would be nice to have hope she’ll do more than just move right more slowly than Trump though.
And I’m happy to be wrong about her evolved state. Thanks.
https://www.politifact.com/article/2019/aug/01/were-tulsi-gabbards-attacks-kamala-harris-record-c/
She laughed because it was funny and I’m tired of people telling me it’s not. 💥 🔫
She’s been a prosecutor, senator, and now VP. She has the experience. She can speak in complete sentences. She is a neo-liberal but that was a given. All Democratic candidates since Clinton have been neo-liberals. The idea that Kamala is anti-progressive is false.
If she she’s was a great candidate she would have been the candidate 4 years ago.
If you’d applied this logic to trump would have even posted this?
Wha… what? What does that even mean?
Dear god, please tell me this isn’t the best you people can come up with.
Funny that’s what I say when I hear Harris is gonna be the candidate.
She was on the ticket 4 years ago. She is VP. Now she’s on top. Kamala 2024!
I’m concerned you couldn’t grasp that by candidate we were talking about the Presidential candidate.
I understand. Kamala is going to president of the United States of America. And it’s going to be awesome.
Of course they are. They started when it was just rumored that Biden would drop out.
Of course they are. It’s infuriating. Even the “anyone but trump” idiots undermines confidence in Kamala.
Cool strawman you’re beating up. I think the majority of us that didn’t want Biden is because he didn’t have a good path to victory. We didn’t want to just stand by and watch the train wreck happen. Harris isn’t much better, but at least she is better, and I will be on board with that of that’s who is chosen. I would rather see Whitmer be on the top of the ticket though.
One of my strawmen replied to me below. You should tell them about how I knocked them down.
You will never please everybody.
I thought I was beating up strawmen? Now they exist?
You do understand what a straw man argument is, right?
The strawman is acting like they’re the majority.
When did I do such a thing? Please quote me.
Yes. That is what I wrote. What specifically there suggests I was talking about the majority?
Do you think ‘group’ means ‘majority?’ Maybe English isn’t your first language.
Just take the L and move on.
Yeah I like Harris less than Biden. Sad day tbh.
The criterion is very simple: Don’t vote for genocide committers, enablers or planners. That excludes Biden and Trump.
If the Dems manage to produce a non genocide loving candidate, then vote vote vote and drag everyone who will vote for the non genocide candidate to the polling station.
And what is your plan for stopping Trump’s planned genocides?
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“I’d rather let someone who actively, aggressively advocates, enables, and wants genocide domestically and abroad to win the presidency, over voting for somebody who passively enables genocide to happen abroad because actively trying to stop it could ignite WWIII” is still a bad take.
It’s baffling and hypocritical.
It is hypocritical to delude yourself into believing voting for genocide is somehow not approving genocide. And i hardly doubt that stopping Israel from committing genocide in Gaza would ignite WW3.
If you mistake it for Ukraine, think about all the help Ukraine is not getting so Israel can get it instead. Dozens of Billions in Weapons to slaughter a civillian population instead of helping Ukraine defend itself against Russias invasion.
I’m not deluding myself about anything. The choice isn’t “vote for or against genocide” it’s “act to get less or more genocide”. It’s not a false dichotomy; if you’re not voting to defeat Trump, then you’re acting to get more genocide.
By not acting to defeat Trump, you’re enabling genocide more than Biden ever has.
In some takes on the trolley problem (do nothing, five people are run over by a trolley an die, flip a track change switch and two people are run over by a trolley and die) flipping the switch is the morally worse option because then those two people’s deaths are your fault, whereas the five people who die because you did nothing are someone else’s fault. I don’t agree with that take, but it’s taken seriously in philosophy circles.
Does… does Harris meet your criterion?
I don’t get how in the Levant, where both Hamas and the Israelis have significant factions that want to genocide the other people, a situation where Hamas does the genociding (because an Israel without attack capability de facto also loses defense capability) is somehow more moral than a situation where Israel does it.
You are making multiple false assumptions in there. The first being that 2.000 pound bombs are somehow “defensive”. The next being that a 30.000 fighters Hamas would somehow genocide all of the settlers, despite their army having hundreds of thousands of members. Then it goes further with this idea, that they want to eradicate them, when all they want is to get their land back. The settlers always have the options to leave and go back to their home countries. Meanwhile Israel as a settler colonial project has to commit genocide to complete itself because as long as a Palestinian people exists, it will demand to get back to its rightful land. Finally you are wrong about the reasons why people in Palestine support violence. They do so, because it is the only thing protecting them from annihilation. For Israelis it is a mix between believing, they need to commit genocide as being the perpetrator protects them from being the victims, classic imperialist greed and a big portion of racism and fascism.
But in the end Israel will destroy itself from within as all fascist states do eventually. The question is how many more people the US helps them to murder in the meantime.