Frozen embryos are “children,” according to Alabama’s Supreme Court::IVF often produces more embryos than are needed or used.
My wife and I had our son via IVF. We wanted every single one of our fertilized eggs to work, but they didn’t. We had one that did and we suffered every time one didn’t.
Fuck Alabama for adding on to the torment and emotional suffering families going through IVF and any kind of infertility suffer already. It’s just adding unspeakable cruelty again.
I’ve seen my sister going through this process for years. It’s emotionally challenging, financially challenging, and risky to her health. She’s had two ectopic pregnancies and had to be operated on twice. If she manages to have one baby she’ll be happy, and there’s no way it would make sense to implant all the other embryos given the health risk to her. So what would Alabama have her do?
I’m glad she doesn’t live there.
Alabama would have probably let her die with one of the ectopic pregnancies tbh.
I have heard someone say in all seriousness that it’s still murder to abort an ectopic pregnancy (which would just kill the mom and ‘child’ if allowed to continue)…
“But god can save her! If it’s part of his plan they will survive!”
/s if it wasn’t obvious.
I mean the odds aren’t very different for the kid after the procedure. Why can’t God save them after? Not even /s, why don’t they ever have an answer for that? If we’re relying on a miracle anyway, why would an infinitely powerful god need such constrained circumstances to make it work?
Murdering a woman to save a fucking zygote that will never become a human anyway. I’m starting to genuinely hate these people.
Friends of ours were going through something similar - they finally have a viable pregnancy, but it took many tries and failures. Fortunately we live in a state that isn’t controlled by religious nut jobs.
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It takes a massive massive amount of time energy and resources, financial and others, to adopt. Its awful.
Then they should count as dependents, grant the parents tax breaks, be eligible for social benefits, receive child support payments, be counted as passengers when in mom driving in HOV lanes, etc.
Holy shit storing embryos frozen and counting them as dependants would be an actual life hack
Pretty sure that’s expensive as hell
So are actual children.
That’s why I freeze dried mine and keep them in the glove compartment for use in the HOV lane.
11k to 15k starting cost plus 400 to 600 a year.
So when talking about thousands of dollars of tax credit it might have a good ROI. The initial cost could probably be lower if the actual quality doesn’t matter to you.
I was under the impression the yearly fee was much higher, but maybe I was co flaring it with the cycle cost of IVF which can reach 30k.
We almost got this with Alabama 2023 bill HB182 which would grant unborn children as dependents on taxes. The bill didn’t pass. These people want children to count only when dolling out punishments.
In a concurring opinion, Chief Justice Tom Parker cited his religious beliefs and quoted the Bible to support the stance.
“Human life cannot be wrongfully destroyed without incurring the wrath of a holy God, who views the destruction of His image as an affront to Himself,” Parker wrote. “Even before birth, all human beings bear the image of God, and their lives cannot be destroyed without effacing his glory.”
wtf
Ironic that he quoted the Bible since the Bible is okay with abortion.
Also the very heavy and intentional use of pronouns.
The Bible doesn’t really say anything about abortion. The most convincing thing I’ve seen is that it values the life of a mother over that a fetus, but it doesn’t say abortion is okay. Unless I’m missing something.
Not that it matters what this book says, I just don’t think it helps at all to misrepresent it.
It literally gives you a recipe for one
At least the other poster offered up what is effectively a completely made up verse.
“effectively made up verse” LOL
Ah ok, so are you the arbiter of which stories in the Bible are literal, and which aren’t? Because that story seemed very fucking literal.
Anyway, this can’t be the first time you’ve encountered a contradiction in the text of your holy book (assuming you’ve even read it), so I’m sure you’ve already got some pretty effective ways of ignoring the cognitive dissonance inherent in your worldview… So go ahead and have fun with that I guess.
this can’t be the first time you’ve encountered a contradiction in the text of your holy book
lol. I’m not a Christian. You’re just exposing your lack of critical thinking by thinking that, because I don’t agree with you, I must be the exact opposite. My child, the world is not black and white.
You’re projecting your struggle with cognitive dissonance onto me, make no mistake about it.
Does Alabama not do the whole “separation of church and state” thing? Lol
No the religious zealots here do not. School coaches require prayer before practices and games, same sex couples get banned from prom, kids at school get tricked into going to fun after school events that turn out to actually be evangelism stunts. A lot of applications to educational programs, gymnastics programs, and jobs ask about “leadership” which is code for experience as a church deacon or active evangelist.
Christians are such fucking idiots.
Excuse me but I’ve never met a xtian that fucking intelligent.
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I don’t recall anyone asking who is worse.
Muslims don’t believe that life starts at conception. So no, on this topic they are not as idiotic as Christians.
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Turkey and Kazakhstan. And this is just racist bs. Not all Muslims hate Jews or have regressive views. Not to mention this is all off topic, it’s Christians who are trying to destroy women’s rights in America not Muslims
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Turkey isn’t much worse than countries like Hungary or Poland when it comes to democracy. And Kazakhstan is in the middle of democratic reform
Also I like how you ignored the rest of my comment. But not surprised
Edit: and people were shitting on Christianity because Christians have huge amounts of power in the US. Far more than Muslims do in any western country. It’s Christians trying to destroy secular rights in the West. You brought up Muslims for no reason other than to deflect
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Simple minded fool.
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We had I think six eggs harvested and fertilized, of those I think two made it to blastocyst, meaning the cells doubled as they should by day five. The four that didn’t double correctly were discarded. Did we commit 4 murders? Or does it not count if the embryo doesn’t make it to blastocyst? We did genetic testing on the two that were fertilized, one is normal and the other came back with all manner of horrible deformities. We implanted the healthy one, and discarded the genetically abnormal one. I assume that was another murder. Should we have just stored it indefinitely? We would never use it, can’t destroy it, so what do? What happens after we die?
I know the answer is probably it wasn’t god’s will for us to have kids, all IVF is evil, blah blah blah. It really freaks me out sometimes how much of the country is living in the 1600s.
Whether you committed murder or not is directly correlated to the amount of money you have and whether you are in the in-group.
Even before this I would get really pissed when people casually said “It will happen when the time is right. God has a plan, though it isn’t one we understand.” In Alabama I was recently at the dentist, getting my teeth cleaned to the tune of religious music, hearing the hygienist say this bullshit to me.
So… all acorns are trees.
Does this mean cops are gonna start shooting trees now?
Oh god. I know people that do this already and call it “target practice”.
Shoot at dead items ffs
Only when the tree shoots first
No, they’ll flash bang the little trees.
Does this mean I can claim my sperm as a dependent on my taxes?
Alabama? More like Talibana, a’ight? Being ruled by religious extremists - in the 21st (ce) century - blows my mind. Are people still that backwards? Apparently, yes. Nothing wrong with a bit of private faith in the sky man if it helps you in life… but to be a fundamentalist is unforgivable.
Why the fuck should we ever have to ask a judge this? Hey judge why don’t you tell us how we cure cancer? Judge, judge, what is dark matter? Please, you are the ultimate authority on all things!
Well get used to it because the US Supreme Court is about to (probably) do away with Chevron deference.
It’s stupid but the article says why:
In the Alabama case, a hospital patient wandered through an unlocked door, removed frozen, preserved embryos from subzero storage and, suffering an ice burn, dropped the embryos, destroying them. Affected IVF patients filed wrongful-death lawsuits against the IVF clinic under the state’s Wrongful Death of a Minor Act. The case was initially dismissed in a lower court, which ruled the embryos did not meet the definition of a child. But the Alabama Supreme Court ruled that “it applies to all children, born and unborn, without limitation.” In a concurring opinion, Chief Justice Tom Parker cited his religious beliefs and quoted the Bible to support the stance.
I know why the courts would ask but in general this is something a single judge has no authority on. The idea that a single person gets to define what “life” is absurdity. We have army’s of scholars following strict rules of logic, ethics, and are backed by science. Their consensus is more compatible with human society than some dusty book.
Absurdity indeed!
Tune in for the next episode of Conservative Politics! [Red state] says menstruating kills potential children? Find out next week!
Not sure exactly what companies store these frozen embryos, but if the company closes or you pass. How are the embryos disposed of?
Does the company need to keep them frozen and alive indefinitely? Or is it murder if they are terminated by the company? What happens if the freezers/cooler breaks? Who is responsible for the now classified murder?
The woman. It’s always the woman in christian fundamentalism.
This is according to a friend who had it done:
If the treatment worked and there were embryos left over, they waited X amount of time, I think a year or so, and if they don’t hear anything from you then they are destroyed.
My friend said she got a reminder but didn’t want to think about it, that it was too hard, so she never responded and assumes they’re gone. She said that to her, she never told them to do it, and that helps her if she ever thinks about it. She ended up having twins.
I recently read Neil Stephenson’s book called “Fall”, in which a significant chunk of the novel is set about 30 years in the future. At that point in time, large swathes of America are referred to as “Ameristan”, because they are break-away territories ruled by evangelical warlords. It feels surprisingly prescient.
We here in bama have been preferring the term Talibama.
Y’all Qaeda is also acceptable.
Neil Stephenson is a high effort author to read but the payoff more than makes up for it. I have yet to convince anyone else to read Snow Crash 😔
Snow Crash is awesome
Even my dad couldn’t convince me to read snowcrash😅 but maybe I’ll find it as an ebook
It took me like 4 attempts and 100 pages before I was able to get into it but it dramatically changed my understanding of reality
I think about the Ameristan stuff and people being “facebooked” all the time since reading that book. In the time since I read it I feel like we just keep getting closer and closer to that reality.
More like the author read the writing on the wall for the past 50 years.
Someone think of the embryos!
Thank a christian for this.
So would they count as dependents for tax purposes?
