I’ve only ever used desktop Linux and don’t have server admin experience (unless you count hosting Minecraft servers on my personal machine lol). Currently using Artix and Void for my desktop computers as I’ve grown fond of runit.
I’m going to get a VPS for some personal projects and am at the point of deciding what distro I want to use. While I imagine that systemd is generally the best for servers due to the far more widespread support (therefore it’s better for the stability needs of a server), I have a somewhat high threat model compared to most people so I was wondering if maybe I should use something like runit instead which is much smaller and less vulnerable. Security needs are also the reason why I’m leaning away from using something like Debian, because how outdated the packages are would likely leave me open to vulnerabilities. Correct me if I’m misunderstanding any of that though.
Other than that I’m not sure what considerations there are to make for my server distro. Maybe a more mainstream distro would be more likely to have the software in its repos that I need to host my various projects. On the other hand, I don’t have any experience with, say, Fedora, and it’d probably be a lot easier for me to stick to something I know.
In terms of what I want to do with the VPS, it’ll be more general-purpose and hosting a few different projects. Currently thinking of hosting a Matrix instance, a Mastodon instance, a NextCloud instance, an SMTP server, and a light website, but I’m sure I’ll want to stick more miscellaneous stuff on there too.
So what distro do you use for your server hosting? What things should I consider when picking a distro?
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Debian
This is the way.
Add unattended-upgrades, and never worry about security updates.
I’m using cron to run daily “sudo apt update && sudo apt upgrade -y” LMAO, what’s the way to use unattended-upgrades?
Debian. This is the way (for servers).
Always, always, always: Debian. It’s not even a debate. Ubuntu is a mess for using as a server with their snaps bullshit. Leave that trash on the desktop, it’s a mess on a server.
Debian
My server is running headless Debian. I run what I can in a Docker container. My experience has been rock solid.
From what I understand Debian isn’t less secure due to the late updates. If anything it’s the opposite.
Debian has been rock solid for me.
It’s not insecure. Quite the contrary debian repositories only include packages that has been through extensive testing and had been found secure and stable. And of course it regularly introduce security updates.
uCore spin of Fedora CoreOS:
https://github.com/ublue-os/ucore
- SELinux
- Supports secure boot
- Immutable root partition (can’t be tampered with)
- Rootless Podman (significantly more secure than Docker)
- Everything runs in containers
- Smart and secure opinionated defaults
- Fedora base is very up-to-date, compared to something like Debian
It’s not conventional wisdom, but I’m happiest with arch.
- I’m familiar with it
- can install basically any package without difficulty
- also love that I never have a gigantic version upgrade to deal with. sure there might be some breaking change out of nowhere, but it’ll show up in my rss feeds and it hits all my computers at the same time so it’s not hard to deal with.
- Arch never really surprises me because there’s nothing installed that didn’t choose to put there.
- arch wiki
Tempted by nixos but I CBA to learn it.
I agree and use Arch as well, but of course I wouldn’t recommend it for everyone. For me, having the same distribution on both server and desktop makes it easier to maintain. I run almost everything using containers on the server and install minimal packages, minimizing my upgrade risk. I haven’t had an issue yet, but if I did I have btrfs snapshots and backups to resolve.
same exact setup, I’m running arch for years on both server and desktop, btrfs and containers. It’s beautiful and I click perfectly with it’s maintenance workflow
I have tons of experience with enterprise linux, so I tend to use Rocky linux. It’s similar to my Fedora daily driver, which is nice, and very close to the RHEL and Centos systems I used to own.
You are slightly mistaken with your assumption that debian is insecure because of the old packages. Old packages are fine, and not inherently insecure because of its age. I only become concerned about the security implications of a package if it is dual use/LOLBin, known to be vulnerable, or has been out of support for some time. The older packages Debian uses, at least things related to infrastructure and hosting, are the patched LTS release of a project.
My big concerns for picking a distro for hosting services would be reliability, level of support, and familiarity.
A more reliable distro is less likely to crash or break itself. Enterprise linux and Debian come to mind with this regard.
A distro that is well supported will mean quick access to security patches, updates, and more stable updates. It will have good, accurate documentation, and hopefully some good guides. Enterprise linux, Debian and Ubuntu have excellent support. Enterprise linux distros have incredible documentation, and often are similar enough that documentation for a different branch will work fine. Heck, I usually use rhel docs when troubleshooting my fedora install since it is close enough to get me to a point where the application docs will guide me through.
Familiarity is self explanatory. But it is important because you are more likely to accidentally compromise security in an unfamiliar environment, and it’s the driving force behind me sticking with enterprise linux over Nixos or a hardened OpenBSD.
As a fair word of warning, enterprise linux will be pretty different compared to any desktop distro, even fedora. It takes quite a bit of learning, to get comfortable (especially with SELinux), but once you do, things will go smoothly.
you can also use a pirated rhel certification guide to learn enterprise linuxIf anything, you can simply mess around in a local VM and try installing the tools and services needed before taking it to the cloud.
You don’t wanna use rolling release distros trust me, the whole point of server is automation and less maintenance. I got couple personal servers running, after things i need got setup and all of them running at a decent capacity, i just turn them on and never worry about them. Old package and software doesn’t necessarily mean less security, quite opposite actually, i suggest you take a look at how stable distros distribute their software, such as Debian. For a Debian package becomes stable, it has to go through several stages, experimental, unstable, testing, and finally stable, that’s why their packages are old, and because they are old, they are secure. It might be quite opposite than what you expect.
Mostly i use Debian for my personal servers, some of them are stable and some of them are testing, because of Podman’s new feature Quadlet. Honestly many features of Debian feel really old, like APT’s source list, preferences, and the way to deal with unattended upgrades. It’s kinda hard to get it at first and it’s easy to shoot yourself in the foot, especially many people tend to unintentionally mix and match packages from different suites for new software. But once you get comfortable with it things just work.
As my experience, no matter what distros i use, the worst distros are always those that i don’t understand and in a hurry to put them into production. Just pick one popular server distro and learn the ecosystem, you will find out what distros you like really soon.
I used to use Ubuntu, but nowadays I just go with Debian for servers (as well), but you said you wish to choose something else, so I can’t give you any meaningful inputs…
I don’t know how real the outdated packages threat, but I would assume, a server never really wants the bleeding edge software and Debian usually gets the critical security updates and patches.
But I’m no expert.
It is true that Bookworm is kinda old now, though.
Yeah I agree I don’t want bleeding edge hence why I won’t be using anything Arch-based (despite the fact that Arch-based systems are the ones I’m most familiar with, I’m typing this on an Artix system rn). But there is definitely a middle ground between bleeding edge and outdated, and I imagine a server should want to be somewhere between the middle and outdated, depending on how they balance stability and security.
I’m also not categorically opposed to using Debian. Ubuntu was my first Linux distro so I’m at least more familiar with Debian-based distros than most other popular server distros. I was just thinking probably not Debian because of how old its packages are and that I’m fairly concerned with security.
Debian!
I’ve heard good things about Alma Linux.
Also, Ubuntu’s not that bad. You’d see this a lot in corporate settings.
openSUSE worth a consideration. More frequent releases than debian, but still pretty conservative
Proxmox so I can run a bunch of other distros.
I have one server running arch and 3 running debian.
So far they are equally stable after running for about half a year.
Autoupdates are turned on on all of them. Which I am aware is against the arch wiki recommendations, but the server is not critical, easy to migrate and has nightly offsite backups anyway.
