Body positivity is such a strange concept to me. There’s efforts to reclaim words while simultaneously calling them bad if used as an insult. Ideally, people wouldn’t be offended by someone describing their body with common descriptors, but socially there is so much value attributed to certain body types that it’s almost impossible to avoid having an emotional response of some kind to various descriptors.
For example, It’s not bad to be fat, but calling someone “fat” is almost universally considered a bad thing. The same definitely seems to go for the idea of being “short.”
I’m asking this question because I can’t put my finger on why but something seems to be different about the use of the term “short” from the use of the term “fat.” I think that part of it is how, to me at least, the term “fat” is so generic and hard to nail down to a discrete definition, implying that the word really doesn’t have a clear connection to reality. On the other hand, height is a single-dimensional number. You either are above a certain threshold, or you aren’t.
I recently learned that May 6th to May 10th is “short king week” because it’s 5’6" to 5’10" which then prompted me to search for the origins of “short king” and apparently the person most-credited with popularizing the term is Jaboukie Young-White who claims the term was meant to include all men under 6 feet tall. The average adult male height is 5’9" leaving men considered roughly average to be called “short” which is still considered an insult by many.
I dunno. As a term that was intended to champion body positivity compared with how the term is actually used, what do you think of “short king?”
I’m 5’6" and find the term childish and insulting. It’s not the short part, it’s the king part. I am not a king, I’m a regular guy working a regular job.
“Body positivity” is garbage. People should be honest and support healthy lifestyles. Twisting reality to make someone comfortable is detrimental to their physical and mental health.
I don’t understand the reasoning but, across the board, it seems today’s culture is very quick to accept literal delusions in place of reality for the sake of feelings and “mental well being”.
I think that you have internalized a version of body positivity that lies on the most extreme end of what is meant by that phrase. Body positivity - be comfortable with who you are and do not put down on others due to their body.
The odds are that I am significantly fatter than you. The odds also favor that I am significantly stronger than you, even if you lift weights. I can also probably walk all day much farther than you can.
Would it be healthier if I lose body fat? Absolutely. Have I tried for 20 years to do that? Yes. I am not ignorant regarding nutrition. I am not lazy. I am not overall lacking willpower. I am fat but otherwise healthy.
Body positively means that my doctor treats my body fat as what it is - one aspect of my overall health. He does not assume that every problem I have is because I am fat, even though changing that would improve some aspects of my health.
Body positively also means that I am not going to hide when I go to the beach. I am going to go shirtless and enjoy myself. If you do not find me sexually attractive, that is fine. If you are going to shame or mock me for my body fat, then you are an asshole. If I catch wind of you mocking me, I will quietly estimate how many times your bodyweight I will deadlift on Monday. If you choose to mock the scars that cover parts of my body from extreme, life-saving surgery, I may feel the need to firmly educate you on exactly what sort of asshole you are.
Body positively often conjures the image of a morbidly obese girl on OnlyFans who lets people pay to watch her binge and intentionally get fatter while she says being purposefully inactive is just as healthy as hitting the gym. The real versions of that person are extremely rare, but their radicalism, vociferous nature, and platform make their voices much louder in comparison. Their argument is also easy to find flaw with and mock, so they get used as if they are a typical example of body positivity.
You are right in that the woman I describe above needs help and is not behaving in a safe or healthy way. I also understand why you might think that is the norm. She is not, though, and I would encourage you to look deeper at the meaning of the “movement.”
The “you” above is generic and based on broad assumptions. You, the reader, might be stronger than me and have way more endurance than me. You also might be fatter than I am. The odds are very good that you are also not an asshole. My point was to call out variances from the norm as convenient examples, of which I have plenty in both directions.
If you’re a hundred pounds overweight, you should not be comfortable with who you are. People who support or celebrate morbid obesity are bad people.
It does not appear that you are really listening to others to do much as commenting pithy things, and I am not sure if you have some specific reason for this or if you are just picking fights.
But let’s still break this down. Literally no one here is talking about celebrating morbid obesity. That is pretty much a straw man at this point.
Morbidly obese people should be able to look in the mirror and think to themselves, “I look good today!” They should be allowed to go out without worry that someone will make fun of them. They should be able to go to the doctor and be heard instead of the doctor assuming every health problem is only caused by obesity.
If you disagree with the above statements, please be very clear as to why. Everybody deserves quality medical care from their physician. Everybody deserves to not hate themselves. Everybody deserves to not be kicked for their appearance.
No one is saying, “Woo-hoo! Try to be so fat it harms your health!” I would suggest you read up on the science of weight loss and why so many little are obese these days. There is not universal consensus, but there is general agreement that the deck is highly stacked against many people, and extra body fat is not a simple condition to deal with in many circumstances.
People should try to lead the healthiest lifestyle they are reasonably able. No one is stating otherwise.
Your other comment I can’t respond to for whatever the Lemmy reason lol, I very much like your take on these matters, also slightly adjacent, what is your dead?
Thank you. I don’t have notes handy, but my deadlift was around 360 lbs. for 8-12 when I was last training it directly. A few health-related issues have sidelined my lifting for a couple months (post-cancer life sucks sometimes), but I am cleared to get back into the gym next week!
My legs are where I really shine, with my calculated one rep max for the sled press up in the mid 800s and working sets in the 600s. That is my lift where people stop and look twice.
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Maybe no one “here” is celebrating it but I see it in pop culture a lot. I agree, no one should be making fun of people. I never suggested otherwise.
Our culture accepts that being 50+ pounds overweight is perfectly fine. This should not be normal or okay. Everyone should feel personal responsibility to live a healthy lifestyle but our public acceptance of being obese has shifted the scale, so to speak, of what is normal.
No one is talking about what a normal healthy weight is because that would impact revenue for food producers. No one talks about what a healthy lifestyle is because that would impact revenue of the entertainment industry. We live in a sick world that promotes laziness and addiction and being overweight. We care more about watching Netflix than we do about playing outside.
Again, I don’t know where people got the impression that I’m supporting making fun of people being fat. I’m saying that we as a culture should not accept that most of us are fat. Body positivity is detrimental to a person’s physical and mental well being - that’s not to say they should be “shamed” or “made fun of”. People should be aware of their flaws and supported to achieve personal goals. Our culture should shift away from the couch and DoorDash and towards the park and healthy food prep.
Body positivity" is garbage. People should be honest and support healthy lifestyles
Feels like you are falling in to the same critism trap that catches “Pride” events, lots of people say that they can be proud of lots of things, not nessecarily an indentity or sexuality.
But pride is more about not feeling shame for things you can’t control. Body positivity is about way more than overweight people, but being happy of who you are regardless of any stigma.
It’s not my place to say people should like “short kings”, I truly couldnt care less about individuals liking or disliking a given term. I just feel your reasoning would be better built upon infantalizing without attacking people that are fidng zen outside of unfair cultural stigma.
Fucking amen
I recall a tweet from a ways back-
sometimes you have to be a bit mentally ill to get mentally well so if thinking naruto would be proud of you for brushing your teeth is what gets you to brush your teeth well grab that toothbrush dattebayo
If calling yourself a short king lets you kick your insecurities ass well then here’s your crown my dude 👑
I think that “championing body positivity” for any class of adult humans is undignified. I think that doing a special extra thing for people in order to reverse the polarity of a judgment about that aspect of them is cruelly mocking them for that aspect of them.
Perhaps there’s something about that short guy that’s actually awesome, and doesn’t require childish lies and role-playing to communicate.
If someone called me “small dick king” I would hate them forever, despite whatever positive intentions they might have had when they said it. Do not make my weakness the key point of my persona, even if you include that awkward attempt at “positivifying” it. Just call me “Intensely Human, master wordsmith” or something that’s actually positive. Don’t treat me like I’m a five year old, using keywords to remap my negative qualities into positive ones.
The whole idea of using a term, that’s special to short men, to “champion” (verbing nouns is horrible) body positivity in short men, makes me feel nauseous.
If we want to respect short men, let’s do so in action, not in word choice.
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pseudo feel-good tokenism bullshit
Brilliantly put. It’s downright insulting nonsense.
My city’s most common tagging these days might be “dadbob”. I see it everywhere.
It’s silly. And 5’10" isn’t short for a guy, and I say that as a tall lady. I don’t think most guys like feeling short, that’s problematic in itself but yeah, as you say, I would feel “short king” a backhanded compliment.
In general I think worrying about things people didn’t choose and can’t change is the worst. I feel slightly different about worrying about weight, but that’s my own baggage.
if you highlight a feature as “now its positive”, what you’re actually saying “normally it’s negative”
I m 164cm and you have to admit that yup it is “negative” (well it s not really it s just that being taller is better) . I like the term short king I think. I m not an english native speaker so no one call me that .that s may be why it don’t bother me.
I’m on the tall side of average (tall to some, average to others, short to few), and to me it’s always sounded like it’s mocking short guys, and if I were short I don’t think I’d want to be called that.
King / queen is insta cringe
I’m a relatively short guy at 5’6". My take on this is firstly that I dislike being called “king” because it sounds patronizing, especially by someone who knows nothing about me (that just feels insincere). Secondly, I’m comfortable, even happy, with my height. There have been many times I’ve been glad that I wasn’t taller. It’s kinda funny watching taller folks hitting their heads on things and complaining about cars being too small.
With my shortness being accepted by myself, someone else randomly pointing it out by explicitly calling me a “short king” in an effort to promote body positivity makes me think that in order for them to be recognizing shortness as a potentially negative trait means they likely thought of it as a negative in the past and are now patting themselves on the backs for being “enlightened” and subtly shaming others who still haven’t “evolved” to their level. It feels like less of a compliment and more of a circle jerk.
Also, I don’t feel like shortness needs any championing. Going back to the topic of obesity in the discorse of body positivity, I think it’s a great idea to treat people as people regardless of weight. But I think the implied premise stated by OP is flawed in this regard. I do think being happy with being overweight is different than being happy about being short. There are no apparent benefits to being overweight, since it generally increases risk factors in all kinds of medical issues. With this in mind, body positivity regarding weight should focus on encouraging others to lose weight without shaming them. The same is not true of being short. Besides the impossibility of people making themselves taller even if they wanted to, there’s no negative to a person’s well-being or quality of life because of it.
I can’t remember any time in my life that I’ve ever been called short as an insult either. This post just seems to be attempting to fix a non-issue. In summary, I would rather no one speak the words “short king” at all. Just go with “you’re such a badass” if you wanna give a compliment.
There have been many times I’ve been glad that I wasn’t taller. It’s kinda funny watching taller folks hitting their heads on things and complaining about cars being too small.
6’3" guy here. Every time someone says “wow you’re tall” I say that it’s not that great. 6’ is plenty to reach high shelves and stuff like that I think, but I struggle with leg room in public transport. I think that’s more annoying than needing a ladder once in a while. Also I often feel my hair touching the roof in smaller cars.
If someone were to call me a “short king,” I would have their name legally changed to “Cellulite Queen” or “The Right High Honorable Sir Shriveldick Pissinbed III” or some other such.
5"10 isn’t short anyway. I think it’s average? “Short king” is trolling 100% of the time. I won’t call it gaslighting (a term I do apply to “big dick energy”) because it doesn’t seek that level of psychological invasiveness. But it’s not intended as a compliment. It’s trolling. Don’t feed the trolls.
I dont have a problem with the phrase but I don’t think ive ever heard it unironically or outisde of joking situatuons. Which is right about where the state of body positivity for men ends up.
Pro tip. Never tell people that even if someone is an asshole calling them small dicked is body shaming, unless you want all those people to instantly assume you’re telling on yourself and then body shame you for that.
I wouldn’t want to be called by any term partly comprised of ‘king’. Just call me short.
Also I keep wanting to read it as shortening and start baking.
Who keeps coming up with this bullshit labels? It is like kindergarten.
My advise?
Words only get traction if they are used.
Whether you are short or not, ignore them. Do not use them.
Best way to win at that never ending game is to simply not play.
As someone who is a few inches below average height where I live, I personally wouldn’t like being called a “short king”. Also, fuck those over 6 foot men for driving up the average height and unintentionally making me have an irrational annoyance because I’m short.
Sorry 😔
It’s not all roses up here either. I’m 6’4". Not NBA competitive in height, but well above the average. Finding clothes, shoes etc is a royal pita. Some amusement park rides I can’t fit in. Having to duck a lot and having to be generally more aware of the height of doorways and hanging light fixtures. Also having people in stores asking me to grab stuff from upper shelving gets old too.
