- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
cross-posted from: https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/17618684
Forced arbitration means any legal disputes you may have with Discord must be resolved through a single third party mediator, who 99% of the time is chosen by, and will rule in favor of, the corporation/Discord. This effectively removes all your legal rights as a consumer, because arbitration decisions are legally binding and non-appealable.
The new ToS goes into effect April 15th, 2024.
YOU CAN OPT OUT OF ARBITRATION. You must email [email protected] BEFORE MAY 15TH (30 days after ToS effective date) with your username stating that you wish to opt out of the arbitration clause. Once May 15th passes you are bound to arbitration with Discord forever.
Opt-out before it’s too late.
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I am not a lawyer, but:
Given the recent trend of corporations trying to force you to give up your legal rights, I strongly advise everyone here to check their local laws and see if this sort of forced arbitration is even legal where they live.
Just for the sake of example I’ll translate an excerpt of the local (Brazilian) Customers’ Defence Code, from 1990:
Section II. On abusive clauses.
Article 51. Contractual clauses referring to the supply of goods and services are void of full right (i.e. non-enforceable), when: […]
subsection VII - they determine the compulsory usage of arbitration.
I bet that most people around the world have similar laws protecting them. Use them or you’ll lose them.
This is true. Generally speaking, arbitration isn’t enforced (or enforceable at all) outside of the U.S. Discord knows this and explicitly states that the arbitration agreement will only apply if you are a US Resident; and any other conflicts will be subject to federal and California law. That said, they should still try to opt out if they can, if only to send a message.
That said, they should still try to opt out if they can, if only to send a message.
Yup - full agree. And I think that they should be nagging their lawmakers to actually defend their interests, instead of bowing to corporations in servitude.
(Note that my earlier comment was mostly a public service announcement, not disagreeing with you. Your point in the OP is sane and I agree with it.)
And I think that they should be nagging their lawmakers to actually defend their interests, instead of bowing to corporations in servitude.
(Above highlighted link is for US citizens.)
Edit: Just contacted my representative, and let them know my feelings about this issue.
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Relevant instructions:
Opt-out. You can decline this agreement to arbitrate by emailing an opt-out notice to arbitration-opt-out<at>discord.com within 30 days of April 15, 2024 or when you first register your Discord account, whichever is later
I had to ask bing copilot how to write the opt out email. Here’s a template for everyone to use.
Subject: Opt-Out of Discord Arbitration Clause Dear Discord Legal Team, I am writing to formally opt out of the arbitration clause outlined in your Terms of Service. I do not wish to be bound by the arbitration provisions. Please confirm my opt-out status via email. Thank you for your attention to this matter. Sincerely, [Your Full Name] [Your Discord Username]Why did you have to ask copilot to write that simple email…?
Yes but No. For most people writing this kind of mail should not be a problem. However, for many different reasons it can become difficult to write such things: This mail is some kind of formal letter and alters a contract. Let’s imagine someone with a learning disability, they may be able to sign up for a online service, as they have done it many times. Writing a formal letter they may not have done many times and they cannot map past experiences the same way as a neurotypical person.
Depending on the local law this may be a reason why forced arbitration has to be opt-in: Typically the law should protect the weaker party. As the barrier for writing this letter is higher than the sign-up process, there is an argument that the chosen opt-out process of discord is targeted against some of their weakest customers.
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In short, I don’t write formal documents often in my role as a software engineer.
There are any number of ways that an opt-out message could be too ambiguous to be legally interpreted. For example, if you just send the message saying “no thanks, I don’t want to use arbitration”, but forget to identify yourself in a way that is meaningful to the other party, it may not hold up in any proceedings.
For example, either your legal name or username may be required, or both, depending on whether you need to prove you are/were a user at the time of opt-out.
Specifying the confirmation is helpful as well in a normal document that someone reads.
Several other companies have made opt outs that you have to send paper mail for as a way to raise the barrier of rejection.
People are lazy. I am lazy. I asked a resource to do it for me and shared the results to help others like me. This helps reduce the barrier to people who would like to opt out but can’t be bothered to figure out how to write that email.
wHy dId yOu hAvE tO aSk cOpIlOt tO wRiTe tHaT sImPlE eMaIl…?
fixed iT for yOu
Citing the username alone should be enough. The email address is explicitly named for this use case only.
Also, eat shit and get fucked, tossers.
My “you cannot sue me for anything illegal ive done” clause is making people ask a lot of questions about illegal things that ive done that are answered by my “you cannot zue me for anything illegal ive done” clause
Am I right in thinking this only applies to US users?
It wouldn’t surprise me if that were the case, US doesn’t seem to be very consumer-friendly.
We’re only billionaire friendly.
Such a shame your billionaires aren’t friendly
You cant become a billionaire ethically, so its difficult to imagine that any of them are.
Exactly
So Matrix exodus? Please?
Haha. I sent them an opt-out notice by email, and it bounced!
They are using Google email servers for discord .com and Google has apparently shadowbanned me. It gives an error message saying “The account [my email address] is disabled.” but I have never created a Google or Gmail account, and my email address is on a domain not associated with Google at all.
So I’ve completed my obligation to opt-out. Discord will have no record of it, but I have the email server logs to prove I sent it.
If, in the future, anyone needs to sue Discord and forgot to opt-out, feel free to use this same excuse.
Classic. Assuming that’s the email you registered your discord account works, wonder how that domain blacklist even works if it’s your primary login. It must have been added after you registered.
That’s a major problem with any non-standard email domain names… They’re always at risk of being blacklisted by the big names due to “spam” (which conveniently entrenches the power of the big player domains like google). It basically means you can’t ever self host email because many large sites will auto blacklist EVERY email server until approved.
Super weird. I remember opting out of arbitration with them years ago… Like, 5+ years ago. Seems funky that they could just require me to opt out again.
I smell Discord about to do a Reddit thing.
Of course they do, anything to make it worse lmao
Discord is such a cancer, happy to kill my account
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Good question, but: Why would Discord ever expect to be in a lawsuit or arbitration with you? Most people, like you, use it to chat with people they barely know and give them no money. Still discord think it is necessary to take away legal rights from all their users.
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@[email protected] already mentioned one. And it does not really matter what the can do specifically to you. It matters what they can do and that you have no control. If you want to know what people can do with just your username look at this project: https://github.com/sherlock-project/sherlock. Now imagine what someone with more data can do.
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Serious question if you know you don’t engage with discord deeply why do you think anyone here should care about your pointless question?
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You just made that up.
