This is getting old and isn’t effective when the only other option according to the US voting system is trump.
Harris is Palestines best bet at continued existence. Sorry if that hurts your feelings or something…
Harris is Palestines best bet at continued existence.
She has promised to never cease sending bombs to Israel for it to “defend itself.”
“Hold your nose and vote genocide”.
Rather than rewarding genociders, might I suggest opposing them? I was told this was the worst crime, but apparently it isn’t as bad as not voting for it.
If you’d like to do electoral math, being an automatic lever pull means you have no leverage. And if your conception of electoralism is to cheerlead and support top-down dictates, you’re actively disempowering yourself.
But personally, I don’t think it should require game theory to not vote for any pro-genocide candidate. Demand better or be complicit. I certainly won’t forget this depravity.
Better just to let democracy burn down. Can’t save one nation so let ours fall and have no chance to right the ship. Yeah that makes sense.
What democracy? Isn’t your argument that you have no choice but to genocide? Isn’t your argument that you can never use your vote as leverage to demand what you want?
The strategy portion of what I listed is how you could attempt to be democratic rather than genocide candidate cheerleaders.
Jesus, why am I even wasting my time. I’ve voted in local elections, I’ve seen laws get passed by voters. That is how democracy works. You’re extreme view of “we can only vote for bad people” is beyond childish. The world is a fucked up place, we don’t always have the choices we would want. But saying some stupid shit like America isn’t a democracy is just ignorant and shows that you have no idea how or what a government is, let along are you equipped to have a conversation about it.
They want trump, really, really want trump.
And they don’t give a flying fuck at a rolling donut if everyone else hurts, as long as they get their way on it.
Harris is Palestines best bet at continued existence. Sorry if that hurts your feelings or something…
continued existence is going to happen one way or the other. isreal is going for an american style genocide which means kill enough of the natives so that they’re a small, manageable enough number and then your country can spend the rest of its existence throwing enough $$$ at their reservations to ostensibly show you’re “super sorry” that you genocided so many of them; but not enough to for them to ever escape this newly imposed generational poverty and also without any promise that your country won’t ever fuck them over again in the future when another pipeline needs to be built.
I saw a meme that was the trolly problem where voters could let the train continue and hit LGBT, racial minorites, [bunch of other stuff here], and Palestine (alluding to trump). or they could pull the lever and only hit Palestine and leave the other people alive (alluding to at the time Biden).
The bottom pannel was the voter saying “I refuse to participate in a broken system” as all the minorities got ran over by the train.
What an incredibly depressing position to be put in.
It might be the “objectively better” choice, but if I saw anyone enthusiastically pull that lever without a second thought I’d think they’re a psychopath. Like you’re still killing thousands upon thousands of people.
I’m not even saying don’t pull the lever, but it should eat at you.
If you don’t pull the lever, those people still die though.
So either pull the lever and (figuratively) 1000 people die, or don’t pull the lever and those same 1000 people die as well as (again figuratively) 5000 more people.
1000 killed if you don’t pull the lever
6000 killed if you do nothing, of which those same 1000 people are in.
If I saw someone hesitating to pull the lever I’d have a problem with em
The haters will downvote. But you’re right and they know it. And it drives them insane.
You can see they largely come from Lemmy.world accounts, the mods there are very friendly towards Zionism, unlike most other instances.
Imported reddit mods. Same power tripping authoritarians they’ve always been.
Lemmy.world is attempting to make Reddit 2, after all.
This seems to have devolved into blanket othering. Which is a great way to isolate yourself in an echo chamber.
The UI layout and elements of Lemmy.world are pretty close to exactly Reddit, without infringing copyright.
Regardless, I see liberalism for 95% of my waking life, liberal views are supported and leftist views are silenced, it’s nice to see more Leftism.
Nah, it’s just an understanding of nuance and being able to see the long term effects of this election. Everyone who is posting stuff like this doesn’t seem to give a fuck about anything but this. It seems you are all ready to let the world burn everywhere else as long as we stop sending bombs.
To be clear, I don’t support what’s happening, at all. Full stop. But we have to help decide the future of one of the strongest countries in the world, there’s plenty to consider. For example, maintaining your right to even vote to effect issues like this in the future.
It seems you are all ready to let the world burn everywhere else as long as we stop sending bombs.
Both Trump and Kamala are aligned on foreign policy, that’s something the DNC and GOP have been aligned on for forever.
But we have to help decide the future of one of the strongest countries in the world, there’s plenty to consider.
The sooner the American Empire loses hegemony the sooner the world can grow.
For example, maintaining your right to even vote to effect issues like this in the future.
If Trump can take away the right to vote by winning, he can do so if he loses. That level of power trancends the Presidency to begin with.
No average person wants genocide but we have to pick between two candidates. If you can’t see how one would be much worse in the long run than the other I dunno what to tell you. At least with one of them you can still vote and express your views. But nah, better to just roll the dice and boycott the both them hope for the best.
You’re getting down voted but this is what it feels like watching our gargantuan government help eradicate an entire people. Like just fucken stop.
It sucks to see people think government runs on vibes and magic, as though bombs sent through crocodile tears are any less deadly than bombs sent with glee.
thats what no material analysis does to a mf. there is a reason why the parasitic genocidal western bourgeoisie encourages idealist worldviews, as liberals will reassure people that the universe will eventually somehow work in our favor. meanwhile, the systems built around exploitation are using well-organized scientific methods. the people who expanded colonial power and the larger global capitalist system are utilizing scientific principles to enable exploitation while hiding these processes from the working class.
100%. They think Trump is a warlock and his fascist magic will imbue the bombs both the DNC and GOP agree to send with extra power. That’s the only way their world view makes any sense at all, rather than looking at the world from a Materialist lense, there’s a grand battle of “Good vs Evil” fought in the ballot box, rather than economic interests and bourgeois infighting.
at least the brazenness of the current genocide made more people wake up to the crimes of western “civilization”
Hopefully the quantitative will shift to the qualitative before Gaza is flattened entirely.
It sucks to watch the knee jerk reaction as everyone rushes to defend because they are so afraid of Trump. Truly hampers progress on all sides with that attitude. We’re not saying something magical will happen. We aren’t saying a 3rd party will win. We are simply saying the genocide will continue because the US needs Israel for the Petro-Dollar, and once again lives are sacrificed to Mammon in the name of wealth.
Exactly, hopefully people realize that genocide is unconditional because its roots are economic, not moral, and states don’t move according to morals.
You’re getting down voted but this is what it feels like watching our gargantuan government help eradicate an entire people…
– again.
sometimes the sense of helplessness that comes from watching us repeat the history that everyone abhors and ignores makes me wish that i was a moderate so that i can fool myself into believing that voting for one genocider was better than voter for another genocider.
i also wonder if my existence at the intersection of several vulnerable communities would eventually dispel that world view anyways if i were a moderate since there are so many brown, immigrant, gay, autistic conservatives.
I’m honestly just sitting here wondering when the main bulk of any populace will realize it is always more beneficial to a society to help each other than it is to recreate the jungle of competition and struggles from which we came. It feels like we have forgotten that all of this was about making life easier and now endlessly chase a goal that can never be satisfied (profit).
wondering when the main bulk of any populace will realize it is always more beneficial to a society to help each other than it is to recreate the jungle of competition and struggles from which we came.
It isn’t necessarily about ideas, but course of development. We live in the era of Imperialism, ie large Monopoly and Financial Capital domination of the Global South from the Global North. The weakest links break, and Imperialism weakens. It’s a matter of time.
It’s a matter of time.
i wish that timescale wasn’t in the centuries.
Probably won’t be at the rate we are going from this point on.
if you’re referring to climate change and i would expect that it would cause the 4th near human extinction event at a minimum; so there’s a chance humanity will survive and there will be some sort of a society if it does.
perhaps since we’ve exhausted most of the easily accessible sources of energy; maybe the next society won’t be able to advance past the next stone age on-wards to develop the industrial or technological capabilities that enable such absurd disparities in wealth they can afford to bend the entire world to their will for a genocide; rending 99% of the world helpless as they can do nothing but witness palestinians culled into numbers small enough that isreal no longer considers them a threat.
Over 10 of the downvotes so far are from zero-content accounts.
It’lll be interesting to see how pro-zionist or political party PACs devoted to social media influencing like (correct-the-record for the US democratic party) will affect the fediverse, and what we can do about it.
I think the most we can do about it is what you have already done and show awareness. Clearly we are already living among manipulators here in the fediverse. We can’t pretend we’re too small to be astroturfed or have any bad actors in here. We’re loaded just like every other social media.
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is putin in the toom with us right now?
no, he’s at home, paying these fucks with money stolen from ukraine. pffft
you seem to confuse him with western leaders and their compradors
pfft https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Looting_by_Russian_forces_during_the_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine
Show me what the west took from russia.
So Trump gets elected, the genocide gets 10x worse, the right allows Israel to completely demolish Palastine and take their land.
Kamala gets elected, genocide might continue for a while, but at least we have time and still have a democracy and the chance to vote in people who will condemn genocide.
There is an effectively zero chance of any third party candidate winning the election, so if you care so much about genocide, throwing your vote away to third party where you would have otherwise voted for Kamala is essentially taking away a vote from Kamala and giving it to Trump, supporting even further genocide.
Any questions?
So Trump gets elected, the genocide gets 10x worse
Why would it get worse, materially, let alone 10 times? Harris has promised to never cease giving Israel bombs to “defend itself,” what’s Trump going to do to make it worse?
Kamala gets elected, genocide might continue for a while, but at least we have time and still have a democracy and the chance to vote in people who will condemn genocide.
Spoiler: there will not be that candidate. Next election in 4 years, if there are any Palestinians left, there will still be 2 Zionist candidates representing the DNC and GOP, and the anti-genocide candidates will be 3rd parties with little to no chance of winning.
Why would it get worse, materially, let alone 10 times? Harris has promised to never cease giving Israel bombs to “defend itself,” what’s Trump going to do to make it worse?
Because Republicans are entirely fans of Israel and would do anything to help them… This is common information, have you been living under a fucking rock? Republicans have repeatedly shown that they will help Israel.
Spoiler: there will not be that candidate. Next election in 4 years, if there are any Palestinians left, there will still be 2 Zionist candidates representing the DNC and GOP, and the anti-genocide candidates will be 3rd parties with little to no chance of winning.
Nobody knows that for sure. If people care about it, they will run for office. It sounds like you prioritize the presidential elections and ignore local elections, because those are what matter in getting “that candidate”.
Because Republicans are entirely fans of Israel and would do anything to help them
As are the DNC, are you living under a rock?
Nobody knows that for sure. If people care about it, they will run for office. It sounds like you prioritize the presidential elections and ignore local elections, because those are what matter in getting “that candidate”.
Ah, the “vibe a candidate that can take the office from an incumbent out of thin-air” approach. And no, local elections are far more consequential, not sure where you think I suggested otherwise.
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