I apologize if this has been asked a ton, still migrating to lemmy. Still stuck on crappy reddit out of habbit, but i’ve found the lemmy universe to be much more helpful.
Basically I’ve had a Dell Xps 13 9310 laptop for 4-5 years maybe? and I’ve put the thing through hell and back. Always (I believe) fixing it though and bringing it back to life. However, it seemed as if any linux distro i ever installed always had some sort of problems. I don’t know Linux well enough yet to be able to trouble shoot because it seems there’s many different routes to do it in Linux.
I’ve gone through so many distros and DEs and have tried everything on this thing. Well I think I finally bricked it after tinkering around with it. So I’m trying to plan a new budget setup.
I’ve always been a laptop guy because I love being able to lay on the couch by the TV and also have my laptop right there in front of me. I suppose im open to a small form or mini form desktop or box and just get a small display and a wireless keyboard/touchpad combo.
I just don’t know how to find what’s better compatible with linux. I see so much talk about “X” computers being great for Linux and to avoid “Y” computers because they dont work well with Linux (which I found out the newer Dells kinda suck. becoming more locked down and proprietary like Apple). I know there’s companys like Tuxedo or Pine or Pop Os that sell their specific Linux friendly devices, but those are all too expensive for me.
I’m looking for a machine that can easily handle Linux but also handle I guess a system or network, basically something strong enough to be a stable link in my entire network; if that makes sense. Because I have many plans for things I want to learn about and add to my network or system down the road. Also something durable and fairly user friendly.
The million dollar question(s)… how am I supposed to know which machines are better or even “compatible” with Linux? like all linux distros or flavors? I ran into a firmware/driver issue with my Dell and linux… they provided only a handful of drivers/firmware for ONLY Ubuntu 20.04. super limited and meant as a windows machine. As far as ram and storage, those are probably not pertinent and more of personal preference. But I guess it boils down to things like the cpu, gpu, ram, idk, whatever is important for Linux? any tips or advice is greatly appreciated. I want to finally take this serious and ensure I have the right equipment for what I want to do instead of falling for the newest, shiny things lol. Thanks
Lenovo/Thinkpad will certify certain models for use with Linux, other brands sell Linux laptops. Those are obviously good indicators that those models should be safe to choose. More generally, the more popular a model is, and the longer it’s been on the market the more likely they are to be compatible, just because they are in people’s hands and people tinker with them and add stuff to the Linux Kernel. So stay away from the latest model that is uncertified, and don’t choose the flashy, overpriced model that will see poor sales.
I have a lenovo thinkbook (cheapy thinkpad) for work with AMD chip and gpu. It wasn’t one of their models certified for linux but everything runs flawlessly for a lean debian build for me. I’ve had linux on several laptops and this is my second machine with AMD chips, and I’ll say that what you hear is true; There are way more, and better, drivers available for AMD if you go with linux.
My 2 cents.
I second this. I got a Lenovo Thinkpad Carbon X1 for work after the Dell I had originally got straight up refused to sleep. I would put it to sleep manually, close the screen and when fully closed the screen would turn back on. Also, it refused to charge properly so I just left it plugged in 24/7. One day it became unplugged and then refused to turn on at all.
I’ve been running Fedora for about 2 years on it and the only issue I’ve had that I can’t fix is the fingerprint reader doesn’t work in SDDM/KDE for unlocking stuff. Fprintd recognizes it and I can enroll fingerprints, it just doesn’t work with KDE for some reason.
The fingerprint reader on mine doesn’t work either. I’ve read up on solutions for that regards Debian but I haven’t tried any yet. I have a yubikey and that works fine as an extra layer of login security.
I wanted the fingerprint reader to work just because it’s easier than typing a password, using something like a YubiKey is the complete opposite unless you keep it plugged into the device 24/7, and then it really no longer serves its original purpose.
Wonderful to know! thanks alot. I have heard alot of good about linux and thinkpads but only up to a certain generation I think? What about HP? my computer repair guy swears by HP but I honestly know nothing about HP and never hear people talk about HP either.
HP consumer products are literal garbage. The only good thing that comes out of HP is their commercial server equipment.
Lenovo won’t let you down for Linux. I’ve run Linux on thinkpads for years, multiple generations. I used to work at IBM, so I had em for work. Rock solid machines, I still run with them today (just the newer generations).
What about HP business grade stuff? thats what ive heard good about. Also any idea on other IBM equipment than their old thinkpads? I have no clue about nowaday IBM but am curious.
IBM doesn’t do consumer stuff anymore they sold the entire side of that business to Lenovo.
HP Business stuff is pretty good but it’s gonna run you a pretty penny.
Avoid NVidia graphics and Broadcom WiFi.
Thanks, didn’t know about the Broadcom wifi part.
I just collect junk from my friends and install Linux on them, lol, you get what you get and make it work
It’s just that my model is a newer generation Dell and I’ve heard from multiple people that Dell is getting more and more locked down and proprietary like Apple, so im thinking that’s why I haven’t had the best linux experience on this darn thing.
Have tried openSuse together with the community repo “packman”? OpenSuse was best distro with compatible driver yet.
On the other hand… https://threads.ruin.io/comment/247004 https://lemmy.ml/post/35749
yes Ive heard they are good too, but i’ve been having issues with mine. it came with windows pre-installed, i doubt that plays much of a role but Idk. like the system is naturally fitted for windows only, so the linux experience has been a little rough around the edges. I have no clue, just a thought maybe
I usually go for business level dells, like latitudes. They’re the go-to for corporations so they’re usually pretty well supported simply because they’re so common
I have also heard this sentiment, that enterprise/business level hardware is best, even for personal use
You basically already know the drill; buy it from a Linux-first vendor that offers devices that you can afford. A list of vendors can be found here. Personally, I’m quite fond of NovaCustom and Star Labs. Fortunately, both have ‘cheaper’ offerings with their NJ50 Series and StarLite respectively.
Thanks! but when it comes to linux hardware vendors like those, for me at least, it’s hard to know which ones are good and which ones are bad or unknowns. also, i did look into the lower grade star labs and there was something about the processors they used… i did a little reading and they got poor marks for being uber slow or something. i could have misinterpreted things though.
but when it comes to linux hardware vendors like those, for me at least, it’s hard to know which ones are good and which ones are bad or unknowns.
You hit the nail on the head with that remark. Because, quite frankly, it’s hard for all of us; I would love to read reviews done by Notebookcheck (or similarly high-profile reviewers), unfortunately that’s simply not the case. In this case, you would have to scrape whatever knowledge you can find about these specific devices (and their vendors) before judging for yourself if it’s worth taking the risk.
The reason, why I’m personally fond of NovaCustom and Star Labs, is because they’re known to contribute back significantly to the open-source community; same applies to System76, Purism and Tuxedo. I didn’t name any these in my previous post, because none of them seemed to be sufficiently affordable.
i did look into the lower grade star labs and there was something about the processors they used… i did a little reading and they got poor marks for being uber slow or something. i could have misinterpreted things though.
If it’s about the processor being slow, then I’m not surprised. It’s from Intel’s N-series, which is somewhat of a spiritual successor to Intel’s Celeron and Pentium lines. Both of which are known to be not powerful. And for that price you shouldn’t expect a lot more, but I agree that an i3 (or something else with similar processing power) should have been possible at that price-range.
Yup, N series
I think your best bet is Framework laptops. If not, ThinkPads have superior Linux support.
Otherwise, pick your favorite model and read online. Also see if you can find your preferred model on Arch Wiki (laptop page).
Myself some time ago I’ve purchased Asus laptop. Spent quite some time (hobby) to get everything working (e.g. fan control) and documented everything in Arch Wiki.
Then I’ve got Asus Zenbook. Also had to participate in kernel bug report and test, because there were no audio. Eventually it got fixed in upstream and started to work.
Then I’ve got MSI gaming laptop. Had to participate in Intel DRM code issue, because 2K 240Hz panel was limited to 2K60Hz mode and eventually it got fixed too in upstream. Few workarounds are there and there, but eventually got it to work almost 100%, but audio is a bit…broken. Works fine, just first few secs after silence are silent.
Basically what I am trying to tell - manufacturers might introduce software-controlled hardware features that might work only in Windows. It requires experience and extensive knowledge to make everything manageable on Linux. :)
A warning about Framework, they’re on the bleeding edge of modular laptop design (not hardware). So while they may shift laptop design entirely, the bleeding edge always cuts. I don’t know anyone with a Framework laptop and if you’re the first person you know IRL to have one be prepared for unexpected issues. I really hope the idea takes off but I don’t envy the first adopters.
Use a system76 laptop for work. Came with popos and works like a charm.
I oughtta browse ebay and see if anybody’s selling some system76 stuff. I gotta see what to do with my Dell Xps 13 9310 thats stuck in manufacturing mode first. probably sell for parts or idk?
Generally it doesnt really matter but if you can it’s best to avoid using nvidia gpus although they will work under Linux they don’t have as good support doesn’t mean you can’t use a nvidia gpu under linux if you want or have to I mean I’ve got a nvidia gpu in my gaming laptop and while it’s a pain to setup it works somewhat well for gaming
Oh no, I couldn’t care less about graphics, but at the same time I don’t want a potato lol so no Nvidia for me
You’ll be fine just get whatever has best price to performance nvidia intel or amd generally amd gpus are best for linux because of there driver support
but its still shit a good exanple of this is the r7 370s last drivers being made in 2015Honestly people over do it with the Nvidia complaints.
Nvidia provides a rock solid driver for Linux. If you are a general consumer it works really really well and it’s easy to install.
Here’s the actual historical issue people have with Nvidia on Linux: it’s a closed source binary which is contradictory to the ethos of Linux.
But he’s the rub, Nvidia open sourced some shit this year, not all of it, but they’re becoming more open about the GPU drivers. But shitting on Nvidia is a hard habit to break lol
Dell is well known for their proprietary fuckery, both in hardware and software. Pretty much anything other than a Dell or an Ultrabook like the Surface or MacBooks (obviously) should give you very little issue. Look for something that uses Intel NICs and you should be fine, Realtek NICs are poorly supported in Linux.
I’ve had two Dell laptops that ran Ubuntu perfectly. Dell sells laptops with Ubuntu pre-installed and also certifies models for Linux. Their Linux support is top notch in my experience.
Seconding this, Dell has excellent support for Linux on their enterprise laptops (Latitude and Precision). XPS are another breed, and tend to be marketed as a ultrabook or a MacBook competition.
Yeah, obviously the ones they sell with Linux pre-installed support Linux perfectly, but that’s like 5 out of their 20 laptops. It would be shitty if they didn’t. People tend to buy a model with Windows preloaded and then install Linux on it though. Even though I used to work for Disney+ as a Linux System Engineer, which runs entirely on Linux, I had to fight with the helldesk to get a laptop that runs Linux, they would only support Windows and MacBooks. I told them straight up that I didn’t need their support and I was able to figure out things on my own. It took me about 5 months to get the Lenovo Carbon X1, granted this was during the end of the first year of COVID.
Perfect, good to know. I hear some of the older model dell laptops are great for linux, but these Xps models have been troubled
One of my coworkers had a Dimension or whatever the “base level” laptops are and absolutely hates it. He said it ran like shit but couldn’t get another one.
My Dell XPS is perfectly compatible with linux
Have you considered a steam deck? Might work for you based on mentioning a small display and wireless keyboard.
Disclaimer - it might require lots of tinkering depending on what the goal.
For example, install JRE from Flatpaks. It will “succeed”, but due to some partition mounted in read-only mode, no binaries would be installed. 🙆
Nope, i dont even really know what they are; always thought they were purely game related and im not a gamer. is it basically like a mini pc?
something strong enough to be a stable link in my entire network; if that makes sense. Because I have many plans for things I want to learn about and add to my network or system down the road.
You need to check out Fedora Podcast EP: Getting Fedora with your Lenovo. For the first time they take laptop compatibility with Fedora Linux ecosystem seriously and announce it with such a deep detail on how they do that.
how am I supposed to know which machines are better or even “compatible” with Linux? like all linux distros or flavors?
I think Thinkpad line seems to be your right choice. Not for all linux distros, but at least Thinkpad has used by many developers in the world, so probably more compatible than other laptop brand IMO.
thanks alot. are there certain thinkpad models to look at or will any thinkpad be ok? i think i’ve heard that after a certain model, lenovo started making changes or something and it affected the linux experience. idk i could be way wrong
You can check the hardware compatibility list in here. The level support begin with Ships Fedora, Supports Fedora, and Fedora Friendly.
they pretty much all run linux ootb. Question is: What devices run without binary blobs underneath the OS?
Sorry, over my head on what a binary blob is lol does it have anything to do with proprietary stuff?
IIRC it means a binary large object. Typically a proprietary part of firmware. Commonly needed for WiFi cards but there are other things too.
Aha! so im not so stupid after all lol I was pretty much right. so how do you figure which manufacturers or even models are more open source and less proprietary?
Old thinkpads are the golden standard of Linux compatible laptops, far superior build quality compared to the crap they put out today. Cheap and durable, if a little outdated in specs. TLP is a popular battery management tool that have specific built integration with thinkpads. I managed to snag a couple thinkpads through FB marketplace pre covid for under 200$ each, my daily driver being a t460 made in 2015. i7 quad core processor, 16gb ram, its weakest link is the Intel onboard GPU. The newer thinkpads let you use thunderbolt 3.0 to plug in an external GPU but there’s a trade off between how new a thinkpad is and its build quality. The old ones could be used as body armor plates and probably stop a 50 cal bullet and boot up fine afterwards, the new ones not much
so what i’ve been doing is finding various models through the generations and researching their cpu’s and oddly enough, nearly every one i’ve put in has had subpar ratings or rankings… idk if that really matters or not
It depends on what you expect your laptop to do. 8gb ram and a 2.4ghz i5 quad core processor is acceptable for almost any computing task out side of playing heavier load video games or specialty IT stuff like LLMs or cryptomining. If your main concern is video games go with the base model steam deck. Also, when you go check out listing for used think pads you will find they contain wildly different specs even if they are the same series. This is because the companies that bought them new X years ago spend some sweet corporate cash on decking them out with the at-the-time highest end options ordered custom from lenovo, and then they throw them in the literal trash a decade later. Some people who dig them out and resell on facebook don’t know a thing about computers and think they are only worth the base options used price.
This helps alot actually because tbh, I don’t know what “works” good together as far as ram and cpu specs
Glad to have helped you out. Whatever you decide to get, I highly recommend you give Linux Mint a try next. I started with ubuntu, went to mint and haven’t looked back since. Its been my daily driver for half a decade now and has worked absolutely perfectly with every laptop and desktop ive ever owned. My elderly parents use mint without issue every day.
A quick cheat sheet for understanding computer spec lingo:
Ram:
4gb = bare minimum
8gb = pretty good
16gb = awesome
Intel CPU cores:
duo/two cores = bare minimum
quad core/four cores = pretty good, most common
more = awesome
Intel CPU processor
i3 = bare minimum
i5 = pretty good
i7 = awesome
Intel CPU processing speed measured in gigahertz ghz
2.x ghz = average
3.x ghz = awesome
hard drive
HDD = Slower and more limited lifespan but ok, tends to be higher storage space than SSD for cheaper
SSD = Faster and much longer lifespan, usually only goes up to 256GB but its possible to find 512GB. More expensive than HHDs
Harddrive Storage Space
100GB = bare minimum
256GB = average
512GB = pretty good
1TB = Awesome
Upgrading
You can have a computer shop upgrade harddrives to a multi terabyte SSD as well as replace the batteries for you if you do your research and provide it for them.
Another big win for thinkpads is theres lots of documentation on upgrading, and you can order official parts right from lenovo vendors through their website Which is huge for replacing batteries when they degrade to the point of annoyance. Thinkpads have an external battery and an internal one both you can replace to get supposedly about 10 hours of battery life. I get like 3 at this point so I may be considering this option soon. The Linux command TLP can help you get a good estimate on how degraded your batteries are.
Anyways Good luck!
Buy it from tuxedo
man, can’t afford their gear unfortunately. my plan was to get my dell xps 13 9310 fixed (bios stuck in manufacturing mode) then sell that and use whatever I make to purchase my next device. in the mean time I get to use this old old probably decade old asus machine :)
Buy it, install Linux, see if it works.
If it doesn’t, return it and buy something else.
Computers usually have 30-days no questions asked return policies.
If you’re listening to people that say to buy specific things, then odds are you going to be paying more for less.
Don’t let their theory replace your experience.
Well that’s the thing, I can’t afford to buy new where you can just return it and all that; I’ll most likely be buying a refurb or used or older but new piece of equipment or possibly piecing together my own, depending on what i can learn about what I need for a smooth and easily fixable linux system
