Told my mom I didn’t want kids and she said, “Oh you’ll change your mind”
I came out to my mom as gay and she said “well you can always adopt”
Then I started intense birth control treatments for my fucked up reproductive system and she was like, “you can still adopt”
Yeeted my uterus, cervix, and fallopian tubes just before my bday this summer and threw a fuckin party afterwards because now there is absolutely no way I can ever be a parent AND my reproductive system can’t do whatever the fuck it wants cause it doesn’t exist!
My mom finally accepted that this part of the family tree has ended after that. This while process happened over 18 years. I started telling her I didn’t wanna be a parent when I was TEN.
Edit: I should prolly say that my mom isn’t a boomer, but Gen X. She’s surrounded constantly by boomers and other members of Gen X who act like boomers so she has picked up a lot of the traits. Practically demanding grandchildren was the worst boomer thing she’s done so far, and I hope it stays that way.
How my grandmother was when my sister was adopted. Never treated her the same as the rest of the grandkids. Even when my sister helped care for the bitch 24/7 while she was living in our home dying of self-inflicted lung cancer.
I was not sad when my grandmother died, if you can tell.
As if adoption wasn’t an extremely intensive process that goes on for who knows how many years and even then it’s not guaranteed you’ll actually get the kid. Let alone how much it differs from DIY.
Ah. See, I don’t want children because I’m what you call a selfish person and want to live my life completely unbound. Kids would just kill my dreams and the vibe.
The ethical part is just a bonus to make me feel even better about my decision.
Sure, but what IS responsibly? If part of being responsible about it is limiting it, how do we decide to go about limiting it? Every answer does touch on eugenics. I agree with the proposition that we need overall less humans in addition to every other step to reduce our carbon/ecological impact, but doing it ethically is pretty hard.
The problem with that is that always leads to two things:
Eugenics
Killing off minorities who “reproduce too much”
Anyone who talks about limiting people from having children will inevitably lead to that conversation. It’s a literal non-starter for anyone who thinks even a fucking bit.
No, as a literal fucking minority, I know that ANY TALK about reducing the human population or restricting people from having children inevitably needs to eugenics or people LITERALLY ADVOCATING FOR GENOCIDING MINORITIES THAT “BREED TOO MUCH”.
I’ve seen this song and dance too many times to not fucking notice it. It’s a non-starter for me and it should be too for anyone else.
Your fears are real and frankly warranted. There is a litteral shit ton of that bullshit going around. Degrowth isn’t one of them.
Don’t cripple yourself intellectually because bad people ruin good things. They do that to all ideas.
Think of the alternatives to degrowth. If you can’t take something within our control, humans and their consumption, and bring them within the bounds of what earth’s natural systems can renew you are comitting us to some real distopian shit.
They all demand magical thinking of some techno-utopian solution that if it doesn’t materialize for any reason you have committed earth to an unsustainable future. Countless deaths of suffering and deprivation because you adhered to the ideology of endless growth, like cancer. Gigadeaths from deprivation, then conflict as our resource base depletes.
All we have to do is dial things back willingly and purposefully. Fully embracing diversity. No eugenics. No death squads. Every life not born (birth rates are already plumeting) means someone, somewhere won’t have to die of deprivation or conflict. We can encourage this, and consumption is included. Lead simpler lifes of sufficiency. Life is sacred. If you are born you deserve a life of sufficiency regardless of who you are of where you are born.
It’s a large sprawling topic. Simple in concept, enormous in execution. But the gist is easy. If we don’t get humanity into balance with ecological carrying capacity, we’re going to lose everything.
When you say “no” to degrowth, regardless of your motivations, you are condeming humanity to a hail-mary of techno-magical thinking. Degrowth requires no new as of yet uninvented technology. We have everything we need. The math is simple. Let not humanity be a locust plague on the earth. Let’s end the sixth great mass extinction with as much of the richness of this world we love as possible.
Fuck off. Anti-natalism is eugenics and anyone who advocates for it is a Nazi in my eyes. Not to mention 90% of you all just project your major depression and misery into literal 8 year olds. Please just go to therapy.
Every conversation people have about “degrowth” and “the earth has too many people” always leads to someone advocating for eugenics OR LITERAL GENOCIDE. The Earth, right at this moment, can hold ten billion people. The problem is capitalism, consumerism and food waste.
Degrowth. It’s not antinatalism, nor eugenics. But simple people need simple answers. It’s ethically shrinking humanity’s population and consumption to within what the earth can sustain. That’s it.
You know what hole to shove your Nazi bullshit up.
The earth can comfortably hold 10-12 billion people or even more. The only thing people think when people say “we must reduce the human population” is KILLING MINORITIES or KEEPING THEM FROM REPRODUCING. There is more than enough space and food for TEN BILLION PEOPLE RIGHT NOW. The problem is capitalism. Not the fact people are having children.
Literally every time this conversation is started the only thing people think about is commiting genocide against a population that reproduces a lot. Take your bullshit elsewhere.
Told my mom I didn’t want kids and she said, “Oh you’ll change your mind”
I came out to my mom as gay and she said “well you can always adopt”
Then I started intense birth control treatments for my fucked up reproductive system and she was like, “you can still adopt”
Yeeted my uterus, cervix, and fallopian tubes just before my bday this summer and threw a fuckin party afterwards because now there is absolutely no way I can ever be a parent AND my reproductive system can’t do whatever the fuck it wants cause it doesn’t exist!
My mom finally accepted that this part of the family tree has ended after that. This while process happened over 18 years. I started telling her I didn’t wanna be a parent when I was TEN.
Edit: I should prolly say that my mom isn’t a boomer, but Gen X. She’s surrounded constantly by boomers and other members of Gen X who act like boomers so she has picked up a lot of the traits. Practically demanding grandchildren was the worst boomer thing she’s done so far, and I hope it stays that way.
Meanwhile. Most Boomers post adoption
How my grandmother was when my sister was adopted. Never treated her the same as the rest of the grandkids. Even when my sister helped care for the bitch 24/7 while she was living in our home dying of self-inflicted lung cancer.
I was not sad when my grandmother died, if you can tell.
As if adoption wasn’t an extremely intensive process that goes on for who knows how many years and even then it’s not guaranteed you’ll actually get the kid. Let alone how much it differs from DIY.
Thank you for your service.
What action in my timeline are you referring to as my service lol
Lol. Not having kids is one of the most ethical choices we can make.
Ah. See, I don’t want children because I’m what you call a selfish person and want to live my life completely unbound. Kids would just kill my dreams and the vibe.
The ethical part is just a bonus to make me feel even better about my decision.
This guy’s an anti-natalist, I wouldn’t take seriously anything he fucking says.
I fucking despise the whole natalism divide. We should just treat procreation like alcohol:
BREED RESPONSIBLY.
Sure, but what IS responsibly? If part of being responsible about it is limiting it, how do we decide to go about limiting it? Every answer does touch on eugenics. I agree with the proposition that we need overall less humans in addition to every other step to reduce our carbon/ecological impact, but doing it ethically is pretty hard.
The problem with that is that always leads to two things:
Anyone who talks about limiting people from having children will inevitably lead to that conversation. It’s a literal non-starter for anyone who thinks even a fucking bit.
Just listen to Michael Jackson’s words.
If you can’t feed the baby; Then don’t have a baby,
You are a very simple person. Does being unburdened by understanding anything feel liberating? Do you do it by choice, or are you just incapable?
No, as a literal fucking minority, I know that ANY TALK about reducing the human population or restricting people from having children inevitably needs to eugenics or people LITERALLY ADVOCATING FOR GENOCIDING MINORITIES THAT “BREED TOO MUCH”.
I’ve seen this song and dance too many times to not fucking notice it. It’s a non-starter for me and it should be too for anyone else.
Your fears are real and frankly warranted. There is a litteral shit ton of that bullshit going around. Degrowth isn’t one of them.
Don’t cripple yourself intellectually because bad people ruin good things. They do that to all ideas.
Think of the alternatives to degrowth. If you can’t take something within our control, humans and their consumption, and bring them within the bounds of what earth’s natural systems can renew you are comitting us to some real distopian shit.
They all demand magical thinking of some techno-utopian solution that if it doesn’t materialize for any reason you have committed earth to an unsustainable future. Countless deaths of suffering and deprivation because you adhered to the ideology of endless growth, like cancer. Gigadeaths from deprivation, then conflict as our resource base depletes.
All we have to do is dial things back willingly and purposefully. Fully embracing diversity. No eugenics. No death squads. Every life not born (birth rates are already plumeting) means someone, somewhere won’t have to die of deprivation or conflict. We can encourage this, and consumption is included. Lead simpler lifes of sufficiency. Life is sacred. If you are born you deserve a life of sufficiency regardless of who you are of where you are born.
It’s a large sprawling topic. Simple in concept, enormous in execution. But the gist is easy. If we don’t get humanity into balance with ecological carrying capacity, we’re going to lose everything.
When you say “no” to degrowth, regardless of your motivations, you are condeming humanity to a hail-mary of techno-magical thinking. Degrowth requires no new as of yet uninvented technology. We have everything we need. The math is simple. Let not humanity be a locust plague on the earth. Let’s end the sixth great mass extinction with as much of the richness of this world we love as possible.
Fuck off. Anti-natalism is eugenics and anyone who advocates for it is a Nazi in my eyes. Not to mention 90% of you all just project your major depression and misery into literal 8 year olds. Please just go to therapy.
Every conversation people have about “degrowth” and “the earth has too many people” always leads to someone advocating for eugenics OR LITERAL GENOCIDE. The Earth, right at this moment, can hold ten billion people. The problem is capitalism, consumerism and food waste.
Everything you don’t like or understand is Nazi?
Degrowth. It’s not antinatalism, nor eugenics. But simple people need simple answers. It’s ethically shrinking humanity’s population and consumption to within what the earth can sustain. That’s it.
You know what hole to shove your Nazi bullshit up.
The earth can comfortably hold 10-12 billion people or even more. The only thing people think when people say “we must reduce the human population” is KILLING MINORITIES or KEEPING THEM FROM REPRODUCING. There is more than enough space and food for TEN BILLION PEOPLE RIGHT NOW. The problem is capitalism. Not the fact people are having children.
Literally every time this conversation is started the only thing people think about is commiting genocide against a population that reproduces a lot. Take your bullshit elsewhere.
Have you spoken to many ecologists about your beliefs? I recommend trying it. You’ll be surprised.
The study I’m quoting basically said that when we had SEVEN BILLION people in the planet.